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MVP-WDS unable to open w/panel inside

JJCCJJCC Junior MemberPosts: 17
I have this problem. I have some MVP touchpanels all docked in its own MVP-WDS. But when a panel has a problem and it didn't loaded well in the wall docking station (like batteries out, unable to boot, etc) it can not be removed from the WDS. It is supposed that you can open the WDS from the blue LED button on the bottom of the unit or from the setup menu in the panel, but what if I can reboot the panel or if the WDS don't recognize the panel to open?
Sometimes the WDS don't open because I suppose that some pins sockets from the panel are well docked and some not and in that case the WDS don't work until you move the panel to align the pins right, then it worls fine.
But what to do when the panel is inside the WDS and you can't open the WDS to expulse the panel?
Maybe some of you have an answer.

Comments

  • DHawthorneDHawthorne Junior Member Posts: 4,584
    The only way I know is to remove power. It's a lousy design and needs a better failsafe. I'm considering putting power cutoff switches at my customers' equipment locations so they don't get stuck panels because they dropped one in hastily and it didn't set right.
  • JJCCJJCC Junior Member Posts: 17
    About the MVP-WDS..

    Thanks Dave. I have unplugged the power source too, but it only disables the magnet and not the security latch, the main reason of why the panel can't be relased. I agree that the design lacks on a security or emergency release mode or button. So how did you take off the panel from the wall docking station, I mean, how do you unlock the security latch?
  • ekeppelekeppel Junior Member Posts: 37
    I really don't like the wall-docks...

    We have repeated problems with the connections on the wall-docks not mating well. If they don't mate absolutely perfectly, the panel will go dead or lock up after a while. It's really frustrating. Most of the time we can just give the panel a slight push or bump and it will begin to charge, then later on that day we check the panel and find it dead again (no charging taking place). Very frustrating.

    We've even tried using contact cleaner on the things, which seems to help, at least until a customer touches the contacts at some point and gets them dirty again. :)

    About the whole docking safety issue, I agree with all the above. It's a real pain dealing with these docks when they don't know there's a panel docked in them! It's just not the best design - too many contacts that have to be made. And what happens when, for some reason, you lose power to the dock when there is a viewpoint docked in it (ie. a loose connection in the backbox pops loose, power wire gets broken, etc..)? We would have to destroy something to remove the panel or dock, wouldn't we? Or is there a manual release that I don't know about?

    -Eric
  • dchristodchristo Junior Member Posts: 177
    If you unplug the power to the WDS, and then, while holding the blue button in, plug the power back in the panel should eject after 5-10 seconds.

    --D
  • yuriyuri Junior Member Posts: 861
    ekeppel wrote:
    Or is there a manual release that I don't know about?
    -Eric

    yes there is :)
    if you open up the back of the unit, and remove power, you can (by hand) move the little servo that controls the "frontlift thing". It's not the best, but it works.
    I haven't really had much problems with the docking stations, but what i know, is that if you put the stylus back in a not so nice way, it also locks the panel in its place
  • matt95gsrmatt95gsr Junior Member Posts: 164
    yuri wrote:
    yes there is :)
    if you open up the back of the unit, and remove power, you can (by hand) move the little servo that controls the "frontlift thing". It's not the best, but it works.
    I haven't really had much problems with the docking stations, but what i know, is that if you put the stylus back in a not so nice way, it also locks the panel in its place

    The only thing about this is, you first have to perform a "destructive removal" of the entire backbox and all can be removed from the wall. I've only had to do this once, and only did it after advised to do so by AMX TechSupport. Given that it was a problem with the WDS, they were at least nice enough to send a free replacement for the one I destroyed. 99% of the problems I've had have come from the customer jamming the stylus in the wrong way. I've even had a few that take the styli out of every panel they get and put them somewhere far away from the panels....
  • NMarkRobertsNMarkRoberts Junior Member Posts: 455
    Thank you

    I'm so glad that so many other folk think they are so very naff. They work really welll - except when they don't. Glad I'm not a hardware designer! 8^)
  • JJCCJJCC Junior Member Posts: 17
    dchristo wrote:
    If you unplug the power to the WDS, and then, while holding the blue button in, plug the power back in the panel should eject after 5-10 seconds.

    --D

    Wow! It really works. Thanks. It is like the system is blocked for some unknown state. I would like the reason of this in order to avoid that it happens again.
  • Wall Dock Power Supply

    Just make sure you don't bury the wall dock power supply where this is no access to removing power.

    I have seen projects where the wall dock power supply was hidden in the wall behind the docking station.
  • Daniel TehanDaniel Tehan Junior Member Posts: 42
    Backbox not mounted squarely?

    I have found the Wall docking stations work very well as long as the backbox was mounted squarely and not pushed in on one side and warping the dock. It is easy to torque the shape of the backbox when putting it in, and if the WDS is forced into a mishaped backbox it will be hard to get the panel in squarely, or get it out.
  • viningvining X Member Posts: 4,368
    Sounds like another situation where having a pin hole in the front of the WDS similar to what I've suggested for the MVP that would simply open the power circuit when pressed and re-energize when released would be ideal. Customers can't remove the batterries so when the MVP locks up and button pushes don't work (yes rare) a tech need to dirve out and now at worst case the customers need to find where the WDS is powered from or at best case a junior tech need to drive out and try to figure it out.

    Of course you could use AMX processor controlled relays or IP controlled power brick or web relays to remotely power cycle these devices and some of these devices are fairly inexpensive in comparison to the cost of the equipment it would be connected to.

    I simple pin hole activated hard reboot (complete power off) would be nice.
  • viningvining X Member Posts: 4,368
    I just spent the afternoon dealing with this problem. I just installed this docking station personally today and the first time I put in the MVP I couldn't get it back out. I pulled the power and re-applied with the button pressed for 10-15 seconds but no joy. The right LED flashes dim meaning it's not communicating to the panel but if I push and wiggle just right sometimes it will link up.

    I literally pulled the panel apart getting the dam thing out at least three times trying to get this POS to work before I left for the holidays with a non functioning docking station. I pulled out the docking station several times to check for racking or what not, loosen the mounting screws, removed screws, what ever I could try and when I left the job I felt confident that my customer would have a 50/50 chance of getting it out when he wants to.

    Now I have screw driver scratch marks on the cover where I tried to pry the darn thing out or move it enough to get it to link to the panel.

    So now I have a slightly scratch MVP an un reliable docking station, waisted 3 hours trying to fix the dumb thing on a Saturday when I should have been Christmas shopping and I get to look forward to a phone call from my customer who with my luck will want a service call on Christmas day to get the darn thing out.

    Why? With the cost of this thing and all the technology and resources at our disposal why can't we get this stuff to work reliably. It seem as of last it's just one thing not working after another, was AMX bought out by Cre$tron? Or are we going back to the Panja days?
  • KimKim Junior Member Posts: 52
    As I understand you! At me on object is 4-MVP8400 and 2-TDS and 2-WDS we have collided what not each panel joined each station... I have been surprised, that for such money and later so much years AMX such marriage dares to do...
    But as we are far and term of sending in service center at us very big, we have left all as is, with hope, that the customer will not move the panel....
  • ericmedleyericmedley Senior Member - 4000+ posts Posts: 4,177
    vining wrote:
    I just spent the afternoon dealing with this problem. I just installed this docking station personally today and the first time I put in the MVP I couldn't get it back out. I pulled the power and re-applied with the button pressed for 10-15 seconds but no joy. The right LED flashes dim meaning it's not communicating to the panel but if I push and wiggle just right sometimes it will link up.

    I found that you need to take the back off the wall docking station. then you can access the release mechanism. Why this is not accessible is beyond comprehension. I've had to do this three times.

    For some reason, our clients tend to prefer that the 8400s live on tables or counter tops. This works great for us in that we don't tend to order many call docking stations.
  • TworhythmsTworhythms Junior Member Posts: 51
    There is one solution that works REALLY well. You need a plastic bendable ruler (I use the clear one that came with a Daytimer book). While the docking station is in the wall with power applied, fish the ruler in between the touch panel and the dock and use the elongated cutouts in the ruler (for a binder) to snag the security latch and pull up to release the panel. I carry one of these rulers with me in my laptop bag for this specific purpose. With a little practice, you can get a panel out in under 10 seconds :) Hope this helps!
  • viningvining X Member Posts: 4,368
    I went back to the job today and replaced it with the demo unit I got with my initial opening order and this unit worked just fine. This is actually the first time I had a problem with the WDS although I haven't really installed that many.

    ericmedleywrote:
    our clients tend to prefer that the 8400s live on tables or counter tops.
    This was actually on the counter in a TDS at the back of the theater but I had to open my big mouth and suggest it would be a cleaner look to dock it in the wall and just leave the phone on the counter. I could have suggested the reverse and mounted the phone on the wall but I think it was the right choice, just happened to get a bad WDS.

    Tworhythms wrote:
    You need a plastic bendable ruler (I use the clear one that came with a Daytimer book).

    ericmedley wrote:
    take the back off the wall docking station. then you can access the release mechanism. Why this is not accessible is beyond comprehension.
    IHMO engineers are extremely intelligent but lack certain practical common sense skills which comes from working with their heads but rarely their hands.

    How this product made it to production w/o some fail safe feature for removing the device in beyond comprehension unless their concern was security from theft, then I could understand it as being a conscious decision not an oversight.
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