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Multiple Zigbee Gateways?

Spire_JeffSpire_Jeff Formerly Caffeinated ProgrammerPosts: 1,917
I have a job coming up quickly that has 5 or 6 R4s right now. The problem is that the house is fairly large and few of the R4s (maybe 2 of them) are close enough to share gateways. I would need multiple repeaters to even get close to sharing gateways.

Is anyone aware of problems utilizing multiple gateways on a single processor?

I do have multiple processors, should I assign different gateways to different processors and use master to master comms for the R4s?

Any words of advice?

Do the R4s like running with repeaters or no?

Thanks for any advice,
Jeff

Comments

  • viningvining X Member Posts: 4,368
    Why not just use a centralized gateway and install repeaters so that the R4's are no more than one or two hops away. The only downfall would be the amount of potential traffic on the loan gateway but with the the feedback module that could be managed.

    The problem with multiple gateways is that you would need to put all but one gateway amidst the wi-fi channels which could cause more of a mess that it's worth. You could pin point the holes in the wi-fi and try to place gateways in the dead spots but if you have Panasonic cordless phones there is no dead spot.

    I like the idea of one mesh grid on channel 26 so that the R4's can roam and control lights and music on the fly, basically creating a zigbee network similiar to the wi-fi network so they can hand off as the client moves through out the house.

    I've had good results on a 9k square foot house with one gateway and three repeaters that covers the entire house and a good part of the yard but if you talking a 20k+ sq foot house then multiples may be necassary.
  • Spire_JeffSpire_Jeff Formerly Caffeinated Programmer Posts: 1,917
    To give you a better idea of the coverage area, I believe the house is in the 35-40k sq ft range. I will work up the drawing later today, but if I put the gateway on the main floor, there are likely to be 3-5 repeaters between the gateway and the R4s. I am not sure if I am confusing myself and thinking about 802.11B/G, but is the throughput cut significantly when using repeaters?

    Jeff
  • truetrue Junior Member Posts: 307
    Jeff,

    If the gateways are far enough apart, you can probably run the same channel on them with minimal / no issues.

    I've done a couple of houses with multiple gateways on the same channel, and even with one home having gateways somewhat close, there were no issues.

    To answer the original question, there are no issues programatically that will affect multiple ZigBee gateway operation, whether gateways all reside on one master or multiple, that I have experienced.
  • viningvining X Member Posts: 4,368
    Spire_Jeff wrote
    I believe the house is in the 35-40k sq ft range.
    OK, you're definitely going to need multiple gateways.

    true wrote;
    If the gateways are far enough apart, you can probably run the same channel on them with minimal / no issues
    Also houses this size typically are commericially constructed using corrigated steel and concrete floors, thick concrete wall and steel I beams skeletons so you could easily get away with using the same channel on all gateways is some case in the next room because of the RF isolation the concrete and steel construction provides.
  • ScottpulmanScottpulman Junior Member Posts: 48
    mulitple gateways

    we have just completed a job using 14 R4's on a yacht, and after quite a bit of testing we found that the best way to use multiple zigbee devices is one gateway per device. We found that by using repeaters or having multiple devices on the same gateway we increased the latency on the system to a point where it was starting to get really annoying. We actually ended up installing the gateways behind the TV's in the respective rooms and had no problems with overlapping channels or anything of the same. We set each device to a unique PAN ID and this seems to have worked really well. I am heading back to the yacht next week for extensive sea trails but in all the testing that we have done so far we have had no issues. OF course this solution only works if the remote is only to be used in one room.

    If the remote is to be used in multiple areas we found that by setting 2 + gateways with the same PAN ID on different channels was the easiest way to achieve the best coverage with the lowest latency.

    Hope that this helps
  • DHawthorneDHawthorne Old Timer Posts: 4,584
    we have just completed a job using 14 R4's on a yacht, and after quite a bit of testing we found that the best way to use multiple zigbee devices is one gateway per device. We found that by using repeaters or having multiple devices on the same gateway we increased the latency on the system to a point where it was starting to get really annoying. We actually ended up installing the gateways behind the TV's in the respective rooms and had no problems with overlapping channels or anything of the same. We set each device to a unique PAN ID and this seems to have worked really well. I am heading back to the yacht next week for extensive sea trails but in all the testing that we have done so far we have had no issues. OF course this solution only works if the remote is only to be used in one room.

    If the remote is to be used in multiple areas we found that by setting 2 + gateways with the same PAN ID on different channels was the easiest way to achieve the best coverage with the lowest latency.

    Hope that this helps

    If this is an ocean-going vessel, that may be part of the reason this setup works. Large bodies of salt water dampen RF ranges considerably. The same setup on land may very well have overlap problems.
  • Spire_JeffSpire_Jeff Formerly Caffeinated Programmer Posts: 1,917
    Thanks for the info. Right now we have it spec'd as a single gateway per R4 with the exception of one area, and that area only has 2 R4s. As for range issues, I plan on using a Wi-Spy device to check for overlap, but I doubt the areas are close enough to cause big problems. I also plan on using at least 2 channels (probably 25 and 26) to reduce interference between gateways that are even remotely close to each other.

    Jeff
  • viningvining X Member Posts: 4,368
    Spire_Jeff wrote:
    (probably 25 and 26)
    You can't do 25. That option is greyed out and not selectable.

    http://amxforums.com/showthread.php?t=3741&highlight=channel+25

    DHawthorne wrote:
    If this is an ocean-going vessel, that may be part of the reason this setup works. Large bodies of salt water dampen RF ranges considerably.
    They probably don't have wi-fi to worry about either. If anything they probably have fixed wired in place desktops or laptops secured for rough seas.
  • ScottpulmanScottpulman Junior Member Posts: 48
    [QUOTE=vining;24914

    DHawthorne wrote:

    They probably don't have wi-fi to worry about either. If anything they probably have fixed wired in place desktops or laptops secured for rough seas.

    VAV wrote:

    They probably don't have wi-fi to worry about either. If anything they probably have fixed wired in place desktops or laptops secured for rough seas.[/QUOTE]

    Actually we do use Wifi and lots of it. Yes VAV is correct the primary network on board is hardwired, but the guests all typically use the Wifi service. Wifi gets really challenging especially in marinas when you have many yachts next to one another in the marina all using Wifi. The Yacht that I mentioned on here with 14 remotes actually has 2 Cisco Access points per room absolutely blasting Wifi on a managed network. ( not my design, but it works by overkill ). This is why the Zigbee is so great for us. It does not have the issues that C******* has with the remotes being canceled out by competing wifi signals. It does have its own issues, but they are less than running a wifi based remote
  • Wireless Training

    For those of you with access to AMX university, we strongly suggest you take the short online learning opportunity, Getting Started with Wireless. The lesson is mostly WiFi related, but does cover the relationship to ZigBee and discusses proper channel assignments for both. The lesson can be found at http://amx.learnflex.net/users/index.aspx.
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