FAQ: Making patch volumes uniform on GNX3

In this thread, we discussed how to make adjustments to your GNX4 patches to make them all have the same volume:

http://www.guitarworkstation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3327

It is necessary to do so because, even though there is a master analog output level, each amp model will sound different, and various effects will also make a difference in your overall volume.

A disadvantage of GNX3 over GNX4 is that GNX3 does not have a per-patch master level. This is a feature that first appeared on GNX4 that allows you to set the overall volume of a patch. This is advantageous for two reasons:
* It allows you to have a soft amp setting boosted; and
* It allows you to adjust volumes without affecting the gain staging of the amp model.

So, the goal of setting levels on GNX3 to make them uniform from one patch to the next, really, is making your amps sound \"right\" without your volume adjustments affecting the tone of the model too much. Another goal is having a comparable volume level on both channels - there is nothing worse than having a barely-audible clean with an overwhelming overdrive, or even worse, a loud clean with teeny, barely-audible distort.

The amp model has two volume controls: input gain and output gain. These are labeled on the GNX as Amp Gain and Amp Volume, respectively. Increasing input gain while keeping output gain the same compresses (and distorts) the signal without affecting peak volume too much; increasing the output gain keeping input gain the same makes the volume louder. Compression gain and stompbox volume will further affect the input gain. Note that these are generalizations and vary greatly from one amp model to the next.

This is the approach I use, and with this approach I have been able to achieve acceptable results 99% of the time.
1. Turn off all effects, compression, etc.
2. First, balance the two channels. A good way to do this is with a VU meter, described in the thread linked above. Use the output gain of the amp model to do this; lower the input gain on the louder channel if the difference is too great. You want to leave yourself enough room to go up later if you need to. You don't want to have an overly-compressed signal (sounds teeny), therefore you don't want the output gain too low on either channel.
3. Next, adjust the input gain on whichever channel it is most important. For example, on a clean amp model, this might be crucial to get the \"breakup\" you're looking for and to achieve the desired \"transfer curve\". On a distorted amp model, this is usually the key to getting the right \"overdrive\" sound.
4. Now, check your VU meter again, toggling between the two channels. Bring up the output gain on the channel that is softer.
5. Add compression; this will affect your input gain, more or less depending on how much makeup gain you're adding. Remembering that compression does not affect the noise gate triggering, you may also want to lower (or raise) the input threshold in the noise gate row of the GNX matrix. Make sure the compression setting is suitable for both channels.
6. Try both channels with a stompbox, if you intend to use the patch in this way. One common mistake is having too much stompbox input gain (called different things on different models) and not enough volume, resulting in a sound that's too compressed - this is common for clean channels. Remember, \"more\" distortion is not necessarily what you need - you can control that with the volume on the guitar - you really want the stompbox for (perhaps) a brighter tone and a slight volume boost.
7. Add effects; it is particularly important to ensure that Wah and modulation effects don't alter your volume too much.
8. Repeat the process for all the patches you're using.

Finally, there are two more settings that will dictate what's coming out as your final level: PRE and POST volume. In this case, PRE VOL is what's going into the effect, POST VOL is what's coming out to the analog outputs. Although the interplay between these two is primarily a means to ensure effects are

Comments

  • iliaceiliace Posts: 5,567
    \iliace\ wrote:
    though the interplay between these two is primarily a means to ensure effects are
    ...are uniform in level, it can also be used as a tool to ensure you're getting the best analogc level possible. You might set your controller footswitch #5 to change the PRE VOL level whenever you change the amp model setting - this, if programmed well, will help ensure that you are using comparable levels for each patch.
  • jamminmjjamminmj Posts: 415
    Using X-edit there is a preset level in the
    effects window next to the expression pedal.
    I have a basic preset which I a-b new presets
    against and also have a specific song that I
    record a new guitar track to using the new
    preset to which gives me consistant levels.
    Easier than mucking about with meters.
    use your ears.

    Jamminmj
  • iliaceiliace Posts: 5,567
    This process applies to balancing levels between multiple patches, not within a single patch (which is what I'm assuming you mean by a-b).

    GNX3 uses GenEdit and does not have a \"preset level\" setting. Preset level makes it quite a bit easier to achieve what's described above without messing around with the amp model levels. The RPn50 series take this a step further.
  • jamminmjjamminmj Posts: 415
    I understand that you are talking about balancing between multiple patches. I should have said comparing instead of a-b as I was really referring to the same thing.

    You have stated that, GNX3 uses GenEdit and does not have a \"preset level\" setting and A disadvantage of GNX3 over GNX4 is that GNX3 does not have a per-patch master level.

    My copy of x-edit as I stated has a Preset level knob next to the expression pedal in the effects menu window. Also the 3k itself, if you activate the wah/ pickup menu, knob 5 which is highlighted and says preset level will adjust the overall level of the entire patch and can be saved per patch and not just as an overall level control for all the patches. I'm not disagreeing with your methods, but my 3k does exactly what you state it doesn't. If that isn't what this is for , then,what is it for?
    Jamminmj
  • iliaceiliace Posts: 5,567
    You might be confusing GNX3 with GNX3000? GNX3000 does have a preset level, and does use X-Edit.
  • jamminmjjamminmj Posts: 415
    My bad for not paying attention and getting into the GNX3 forum
    instead of the GNX3000 Forum. Long week.

    Jamminmj
  • <div style="displaynone">fiogf49gjkf0d</div>wow i tried this and it made my sound much tighter and smoother sounding.A good way to start refining your sound.
  • BD15BD15 Posts: 1
    FWIW here is what I did to get around the volume issue. First, backed up all the presets then started making a preset at the desired volume and whatever effects to make \"my\" base sound.
    Then using the editor, that preset was cloned across a bank of 5. Next, edit the remaining 4 presets how you like. The basic volume level is, well, level across the presets for that bank.
    Also, then entire bank of 5 presets are now related and can be grouped by style of sound or depth of settings. I play live quite often and having the banks set to specific styles or song sets gets around the whole level problem and allows the freedom to experiment and play without worrying about it. This is what I did and it works quite well. Thx.
  • RobertoRoberto Posts: 4

    como puedo regresar mi pedal a los efectos de fabrica? por favor alguien que me apoye

  • RobertoRoberto Posts: 4

    como puedo regresar mi pedal GNX3 a los efectos de fabrica? por favor alguien que me apoye

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