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Ni-4100 RS-232 Problem

prakashprakash Posts: 33
in AMX Technical Discussion
Hi,

I am using NI-4100. IR and relays are workingfine but Serial devices are not responding. DIP switches are OFF OFF OFF OFF OFF ON ON ON ON. I checked my connections and also checked baud rates but only Tx is blinking in RS-232 devices when i am giving commands to my controller. Virtual devices are also shoeing in online tree.

Any suggestions plz....

Comments

  • viningvining Posts: 4,368
    Try these for the likely answer.

    http://www.amxforums.com/search.php?searchid=466234
  • ericmedleyericmedley Posts: 4,177
    Vining,
    The link no workie
    :(
  • viningvining Posts: 4,368
    Hmm, it worked yesterday. Well the OP can just do a search for C206 which was all that link was.

    This is the link that search gives me today, it shows four threads.
    http://www.amxforums.com/search.php?searchid=466436
  • ericmedleyericmedley Posts: 4,177
    Yep. :D
    We've all experienced the capacitor issue.
  • prakashprakash Posts: 33
    Link not workin
  • viningvining Posts: 4,368
    prakash wrote: »
    Link not workin

    Do a forum search for c206.

    Apparently a search result link has a short life span.
  • RicardoSiqueiraRicardoSiqueira Posts: 373
    Most likely you are experiencing the c206 (Capacitor) failure. In the past 3 years, I've problem sent back more than 8 NIs for repair due to this c206 failure. It affects the whole serial bus and ports. IR, I/O and Relay ports will still work, but no serial communications.
  • DHawthorneDHawthorne Posts: 4,584
    You can pretty much expect the capacitor issue on any NI master more than 3 years old. It's near inevitable if it hasn't already been replaced.
  • HedbergHedberg Posts: 671
    It's my understanding that the capacitor is in the power supply circuit that supplies the voltage for RS232 communications. RS422 and RS485, as I understand it, still work. If a master is controlling but one or two items by RS 232, it may be possible to use inexpensive RS422 to RS232 adapters. Or, an Axcent3 as a slave.

    We've been upgrading systems that had the Panja NI controllers in them with NI3100s. I don't think I've seen a failure with one of the Panjas yet.
  • John NagyJohn Nagy Posts: 1,742
    We have sites still using NXI and even Axcent3 units that never ever had a problem. It started with the NI... and took nearly 8 years to start to show up, first and worst on the 2000/3000 and less often on the 2100/3100. But that may be because they are newer and haven't gotten to fail time yet.

    AMX has said that "later production" NI 2100/3100's have improved circuitry/parts and should not have this failure. When they are another 5 years older, we'll know.

    They know which are the newer ones by serial number. They'll tell you if yours is newer.
    They will repair the serial ports on any "eligible" older processor for $150. We and our dealers have sent in dozens of them.
    Eligible meaning not a newer one built after the changes. But the newer ones "shouldn't" need it, right?

    We've seen very few (but a few) failures on the "checkerboard paint" NI's. We've seen plenty on the "stripe paint" models. This is not a prediction, it is our observation.

    We won't repurpose or update any systems using an older NI without doing an AMX rebuild as a matter of course. $150 is cheap compared to rolling a truck and having to replace the unit later. Actually, we keep a few fresh rebuilds and trade them into systems when we do significant other services... instead of waiting for them to fail. Then the takeout goes in for refurb, and becomes stock.
  • danieldrew1danieldrew1 Posts: 31
    C206 problem?

    OK, perhaps I have narrowed down my problem. I thought it was in the code that I could not set up my lighting control but now in trying to set up audio distribution through serial, I am not getting results either.
    I crossed pins 2 and 3 to check in "notifications" if I my string was getting through. I see the string sent to the proper port upon "button event" but no return string.

    I found the threads on the capacitor (c206) issue with the NI-3100 controllers. I do not seem to have RX on any serial port though my meter reads 10v between pins 3 and 5. Could this still be a problem with the capacitor?
    I am considering the option of repairing it myself based on some write ups I saw both on this forum and this web site- http://www.jackkolesar.com/articles/2012/08/18/amx_ni3000_serial_port_fail.html
    It doesn't seem too difficult and it appears from other post that AMX is charging a healthy fee now to resolve the problem.

    Has anybody changed this capacitor themselves with good results?
  • ericmedleyericmedley Posts: 4,177
    danieldrew1 wrote: »
    OK, perhaps I have narrowed down my problem. I thought it was in the code that I could not set up my lighting control but now in trying to set up audio distribution through serial, I am not getting results either.
    I crossed pins 2 and 3 to check in "notifications" if I my string was getting through. I see the string sent to the proper port upon "button event" but no return string.

    I found the threads on the capacitor (c206) issue with the NI-3100 controllers. I do not seem to have RX on any serial port though my meter reads 10v between pins 3 and 5. Could this still be a problem with the capacitor?
    I am considering the option of repairing it myself based on some write ups I saw both on this forum and this web site- http://www.jackkolesar.com/articles/2012/08/18/amx_ni3000_serial_port_fail.html
    It doesn't seem too difficult and it appears from other post that AMX is charging a healthy fee now to resolve the problem.

    Has anybody changed this capacitor themselves with good results?

    Sounds like the cap issue for sure. I just replaced a master last week for the same reason. Amazing how a cheap component can cause such a catastrophic failure.
  • AuserAuser Posts: 506
    danieldrew1 wrote: »
    I do not seem to have RX on any serial port though my meter reads 10v between pins 3 and 5. Could this still be a problem with the capacitor?

    Unlikely. There is a chance that the cap is on its way out, but if you are seeing 10V on the TX pin then the charge pump circuitry is doing its job.

    Plug a loopback adaptor into the serial port (ie. short pins 2 and 3) and see if you are getting responses when you send a string. Ignore waiting for responses in diagnostics - watch the LEDs on the front panel of the unit.

    - If the TX and RX ports both light up, the serial port's fine.
    - If the TX LED does not light check your code/DPS addressing in diagnostics.
    - If the TX light is flashing but the RX light is not, issue the following commands to the port and try again:
    SEND_COMMAND <DEV>,"'RXON'"
SEND_COMMAND <DEV>,"'HSOFF'"

    If it's still not working after sending these commands, it may be a faulty port due to the capacitor issue.
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