8400 panel doesnt respond to touch

JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior MemberPosts: 99
I have a 8400 touch panel(P1) that was working yesterday but I took out the Compact Flash card(4Gig but only 64 meg ram) and put it to another panel (P2) that had 128MB ram. Once I did that the second panel worked right away and I took the CF card from the 2nd panel which has 256MB, and installed it in the 1st panel - then the touch didn't work. I reset the panel wifi parameters to match the panel it came from and that part works. So I took the CF card from the 2nd panel 256MB and put it to a third panel (P3) and the touch worked there. It seems that any CF card I put in the first panel doesn't work- touch portion. I even put the CF card back from the original (P1)and it also doesn't work. I even did a firmware upgrade to P1 even though I had the latest version for 8400 --2.86.55.
So I guess I am trying to understand the role of the CF card. It appears when u do a firmware upgrade it goes right the CF card, but isn't there also like a bios on the motherboard that also gets info? I am thinking that somehow the motherboard 'bios' (dont know what to call it) got confused and somehow disabled touch? Does anyone have any idea on this, as it cant be the CF card being corrupted because when I introduced third panel P3 the CF card worked in that panel.

Comments

  • cmasoncmason Junior Member Posts: 123
    Is it possible, you may have damaged something on the first panel, rendering the touch screen portion dead?

    Did you try to re-calibrate the touch screen?
  • JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior Member Posts: 99
    8400 panel doesnt respond to touch

    I cant recalibrate cuz the touch doesn't work. If I hold the left and right lower buttons for 6 seconds the calibrate screen comes up but when I click nothing happens. But I didn't take it apart all I did was swap out the CF card. In other panels I did notice if you chip the glass around the green ribbon on the glass panel it may render the touch in operable (touch wont work) , but like I said I didn't get that far.
  • cmasoncmason Junior Member Posts: 123
    JOHNBONZ wrote: »
    I cant recalibrate cuz the touch doesn't work. If I hold the left and right lower buttons for 6 seconds the calibrate screen comes up but when I click nothing happens. But I didn't take it apart all I did was swap out the CF card. In other panels I did notice if you chip the glass around the green ribbon on the glass panel it may render the touch in operable (touch wont work) , but like I said I didn't get that far.

    Don't you have to take it apart to get to the CF card? The few 8400s I've dismantled took a bit to get them opened up to get to the CF card. I was only speculating...
    Since the original CF card (proven working on another panel) does not bring the panel back to a working condition, one could conclude that the problem exists on the panel itself. If all of the other functions of the panel work, I'd assume it's a hardware problem.

    A trick I use to get to the calibration screen when the TP gets out of calibrations is to VNC to the panel. You will have full control of the panel as the touch part is not utilized. Get to the setup screen and then with VNC click to the calibration screen. Or alternatively you can send setup codes to the panel to get to where you need to.
  • JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior Member Posts: 99
    8400 panel doesnt respond to touch

    to get at CF card all u do is take out the two silver front screws and unsnap the plastic cover. But to take off the glass panel, u take off the perimeter black screws and that is a pain.
    What is "VNC to the panel"?.ohh u mean webcontrol? Yes that is kinda cool but u cant calibrate using that tool, u still have to physically touch the screen.
    I just used VNC on this panel and I was navigating around but only thru the web interface as the touch still is out of commission
  • cmasoncmason Junior Member Posts: 123
    JOHNBONZ wrote: »
    to get at CF card all u do is take out the two silver front screws and unsnap the plastic cover. But to take off the glass panel, u take off the perimeter black screws and that is a pain.
    What is "VNC to the panel"?.ohh u mean webcontrol? Yes that is kinda cool but u cant calibrate using that tool, u still have to physically touch the screen.
    I just used VNC on this panel and I was navigating around but only thru the web interface as the touch still is out of commission

    Maybe, accidental static discharge when you took the case off, fried something? Static discharge is pretty prevalent this time of year.

    Yes, I thought you couldn't get to the calibration screen. I use VNC (VNC is the protocol web-control uses) to get to the calibration screen and then touch the screen physically, to fix a calibration issue.

    If the calibration screen does not respond, I'd say you have a hardware failure.

    EBay one for ~ $100?
  • DHawthorneDHawthorne Junior Member Posts: 4,584
    It may just have a very wonky calibration. If you can telnet to it, send ^CAL to the panel, and the calibration screen should come up. You may then be able to calibrate, and all will be well. If not, the overlay probably went bad. I don't think the CF has anything to do with that though, just unlucky coincidence.
  • JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior Member Posts: 99
    8400 panel doesnt respond to touch

    I Telnet to the IP of the panel in question, but when I enter ^CAL it says unknown command.
    The commands available in Telnet for the Panel are:

    ? or Help This list.
    disk free Show the amount of free space on the disk.
    get connection Show the master settings.
    get device Show the device number.
    get dns Show the DNS configuration of a device.
    get ip Show the IP configuration.
    get config Show the current configuration.
    renew dhcp Renew the DHCP IP lease.
    mem Shows size of the largest block of available memory.
    msg on|off Enables/Disables extended diagnostic messages.
    ping [address] Pings an address. Address may be an IP or URL.
    reboot Reboots the device.
    set device Setup the device number.
    set connection Setup the master settings.
    set dns Setup the DNS configuration of a device.
    set ip Setup the IP configuration of a device.
    show log <start> Display the message log. <start> specifies message
    setup Display setup page on panel.
    get cache enable Get the state of the image cache flash backup
    get cache expire Get current expiration time for image cache entries
    get cache size Get flash cache maximum size
    toggle cache enable Toggle the state of the image cache flash backup
    cache purge [mask] Purge image cache (bit 0=NV, bit 1=RAM)
    set cache expire Set expiration duration for image cache entries
    set cache size Set flash cache maximum size
    show connection log [all] Show the connection logs for the panel.
    show connection stats Show the connection logs for the panel.
    wireless version Displays the versions of all the wireless tools.
    wireless scan Scans for all available AP at the site.
    ssidlog on|off Enables/Disables SSID logging in the Connection Log.
    version Show firmware version numbers.
    exit Close this telnet session.

    ---- Extras ----
    batt mon <interval> Show the battery charge stats every <interval> seconds.
    Default interval is two seconds. ESC to exit.
    batt time <interval> Show the battery time stats every <interval> seconds.
    Default interval is two seconds. ESC to exit.
    base mon <interval> Show base battery change stats every <interval> seconds.
    Default interval is two seconds. ESC to exit.
    base temp <interval> Show base battery temp stats every <interval> seconds.
    Default interval is two seconds. ESC to exit.
    get batt <b> Show the battery info for battery b.
    get gen <b> <c> Show the generic battery info for battery b code c.
    load certificates <ip>Loads certificate from master <ip>.


    whereas the commands for the controller are many more.
    So how do I issue this command?
  • ericmedleyericmedley Senior Member - 4000+ posts Posts: 4,159
  • JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior Member Posts: 99
    8400 panel respond to touch

    CALIBRATE - doesn't work - I am connected to panel thru Telnet.
    So have u ever used this command before - if so thru Telnet?
  • John NagyJohn Nagy CineTouch Product Manager Posts: 1,526
    The best you can hope to happen through issuing the Calibrate command (in whatever form, by whatever means) is to get the Calibrate page on screen, ready to take your touch readings and map the screen. You've already gotten that far by other means, and reported that the screen is unresponsive to touches when CALIBRATE is engaged. So I don't know what you hope to achieve by getting to the same dead end by other means.

    If the silver buttons get you to SETUP and CALIBRATE, the panel innards are processing input it sees correctly. If the touch screen delivers no touch information to the innards, you will not get any further.

    Your disassembly nearly certainly brought this on. Odds of an unrelated failure with this timing are nil. Odds of it being a firmware or FLASH card issue are very small, since the silver buttons still map.

    You have little to lose in opening it back up and retracing your steps. Look for a ribbon connector pulled out of a socket, a ground strap disconnected, a component pulled off a circuit board trace.

    ALSO LOOK CAREFULLY TO SEE THAT YOU ARE NOT TRAPPING A WIRE OR ANYTHING BETWEEN THE TOUCH SURFACE AND THE CASE. If you are, it's sending a digitizer point at all times, like your finger is already on a button 24/7. The panel will ignore that "permanent touch" and will not see any others. Try powering up the panel with the front case off and away from the glass. It may work again. I've "repaired" several dead panels by cleaning gunk out from between the case the glass.

    Same problem if you get a serious dent in the overlay... you have a permanent touch.

    And as has been stated, don't lose a lot of hours to this unless you really don't care about the economics of the matter. You can buy 7500's any day you want for $50, usually less, 8400's for $100 or less, and 8400i's for $200 or less, working and sometimes with batteries and chargers and docks that might be useful... all at the Bay of E.
  • JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior Member Posts: 99
    8400 panel doesnt respond to touch

    All good ideas, but the panel touch went dead when I swapped out CF card, 4gig for a 256MB. That's all I did. I also put back the 4gig CF card to panel and that didn't do anything.
    So by swapping out CF card something may have occurred. Not sure what, because I have done this many times.
    Does the CF card control the touch functionality of the glass?
  • ericmedleyericmedley Senior Member - 4000+ posts Posts: 4,159
    JOHNBONZ wrote: »
    All good ideas, but the panel touch went dead when I swapped out CF card, 4gig for a 256MB. That's all I did. I also put back the 4gig CF card to panel and that didn't do anything.
    So by swapping out CF card something may have occurred. Not sure what, because I have done this many times.
    Does the CF card control the touch functionality of the glass?

    Yes, changing the CF can clear out the data that tells the hardware where the touch points are.

    I'd suggest you do the power up method of getting to the calibration page.

    Pull the batteries so the panel is dead. Then power it up. Hold your finger in the center of the screen. Don't let go. Keep holding past the boot up. After a few seconds you'll be taken to the setup page. KEEP HOLDING. After a few more seconds you'll then be taken to the calibration screen.
  • JOHNBONZJOHNBONZ Junior Member Posts: 99
    8400 panel doesnt respond to touch

    Ok I tried the power up method of getting to the calibration page -on bad panel 1, didn't work. So I took the CF card out 256mb panel 1, and put it in a good panel (panel 2) and did power up and calibration screen came up and I went thru calibration on good panel. Then took out the CF card from panel 2 and put it in the non-touch panel 1 and tried same thing - no luck. This screen does connect and I use Web control to navigate around. So it is NOT the CF card, not wireless card - so down to 2 suspects: a) glass panel, b) motherboard.
    The glass panel looks pristine - no chips in the green ribbon area around edges. I wonder if there is a way to test just the panel - like a continuity test , I don't think I have proper equipment.
    So that leaves it down to motherboard but I just find this hard to believe since I have actually two units that behave same way - both connect to my network and I can navigate both using Webcontrol but just the touch part doesn't work. Just seems like a coincidence that out of the 15 panels I have 2 behave this way.
    if I have the guts , to test if glass panel is bad --- I will take the glass from panel 1 and try to see if it works in Panel 2 motherboard - I want to exhaust all my options first and I think I may have.
  • John NagyJohn Nagy CineTouch Product Manager Posts: 1,526
    The only certain thing is that the longer you work on this, you drive your hourly wage down deeper into the single digits. There's a time when it's not worth the hours, even if you succeed.
  • ericmedleyericmedley Senior Member - 4000+ posts Posts: 4,159
    John Nagy wrote: »
    The only certain thing is that the longer you work on this, you drive your hourly wage down deeper into the single digits. There's a time when it's not worth the hours, even if you succeed.

    True,
    Especially when you consider that there are 8400s on eBay for less than $100...
  • syslocksyslock Junior Member Posts: 45
    Try removing the wireless card and testing the touch interface and calibration again I've had experience with faulty wireless cards causing issues with the touch. Also there is no harm in resetting and cleaning the touch interface ribbon cable. Also check the batteries are full charged when testing the touch and calibration I've seen a couple of panels loose there touch capabilities while the batteries are charging.
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