Panelbuilder Template Gripes
Chip Moody
Posts: 727
Okay, am I the ONLY person that likes to have master volume/mute controls & display visible on a touch panel at ALL times, regardless of which set of device controls is being displayed?
All of the P.B. templates make me feel like what I do is an oddity, and that forcing a user (who might be panicing when their DVD starts playing at an incredible volume level) to go to a seperate page for volume control is the norm.
I like a lot of the snazzy-looking themes that P.B. allows us, but hate the fact that I need to implement a boring volume guage when the mega-cool looking one in the template file doesn't fit anywhere outside of the template's predetermined layout...
- Chip
All of the P.B. templates make me feel like what I do is an oddity, and that forcing a user (who might be panicing when their DVD starts playing at an incredible volume level) to go to a seperate page for volume control is the norm.
I like a lot of the snazzy-looking themes that P.B. allows us, but hate the fact that I need to implement a boring volume guage when the mega-cool looking one in the template file doesn't fit anywhere outside of the template's predetermined layout...
- Chip
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Comments
What I do when using the panel builder is just generate a framework, then open it up in TPD4 and edit it manually from there. I find that I don't like many of the conventions it is built on, and a volume page treated like it were a source in it's own right is one of them.
More typically for me is to make a fully transparent popup, then cut and paste the fancy bargraph on to that and resize it accordingly. I use the hardware buttons for volume up and down,and popup my bargraph page on a press, then do a simple wait on release to hide it 10 seconds later. The only thing I've found you need to watch for is that if a page is flipped manually before teh popup fades is to explicitly hide it before the flip, or it will miss the ^PPF command and still be there next time you go back to that page.
In some cases, however, I'll just paste the thing on to all my device pages and leave it at that for customers who prefer it, and/or would like to drag the bar around to adjust volume rather than use the buttons.
Jeff
DHawthorne: What are some of the other conventions you're referring to?
bugbee
Here's an example of what I mean (note, the lighting flips won't work without the code support, but the exit button will take you to the active sourch or the startup page on the live system). This is a real customer file in use today, modified only for anonymity:
Example2
Edit: Oh, and I might add I am using the fancy volume graph included in the file. It is also code driven to pop up on a vloume button press (as long as the system is on), then hide 10 seconds ater release. You will see if you show it in place on any of the pages that I've resized it to fit nicely in that relatively blank space where I put my vol and channel labels for the hardware buttons.
PS - Any job without a codec is a great one!
Really nice for a TP3 expert that suddenly needs a Modero working in a week.
Kevin D.
Get rid of? I don't put a mode selector symbol in the project - just go straight from the "start" symbol to a navigation symbol.
- Chip
Maybe not, but if you're doing one for a somewhat swanky boardroom w/lots of wood & such - and you're NOT using a 7500 panel - try a "Crimson Curves" layout from panel builder... Even for a simple room, it'll look really nice.
- Chip
I think I did the same or similar thing...
I just finished up a big project - the first one I used Panel Builder for - four rooms using a combination of 4 TPI/4's, 2 MVP-8400's and a MVP-7500.
I used Panel Builder to make a TPD4 file containing pages for each type of device I needed to control, then completely re-did a whole lot of things >in< TPD4 using it as a template. I changed it from having multiple pages to having one main page with all the device controls "sliding in" on popups. Also, while the P.B. version had a background graphic where device controls appeared, I didn't like being "locked in" to a background that size at all times. I wound up deleting the graphic, and instead creating a button with a similar border & background to the graphic, then just re-sized it as needed and put it in the background on the popup pages...
Using P.B. to start off with did get me a REALLY nice looking background, buttons & general layout based on a particular theme - but I did have to tweak a good amount to massage it into something I (IMHO) thought was more usable. I'm not knocking it in any way - if I had tried to do this from scratch, the client would have some seriously bland looking touch panels...
- Chip
Being that it was a brand-new software project, our target was to initially hit somewhere near the magic 80/20 number: G4 PanelBuilder doing 80% of the work for you, and the remaining 20% being done in TPDesign4 in the form of customizations, tweaks, additions, etc. Our research indicated that most of our dealers/distributors were more than capable of using TPD4 to "finish off" a panel if given a starting point; but not everyone has a graphic artist on staff to give them that starting point.
Obviously, for some jobs, G4 PanelBuilder may do more than 80% of the work; sometimes much less. When it does less, we'd certainly like to hear what you wish the templates had in them and we will see if that is that is feasible to actually put into future templates. Keep in mind, though, that if a particular AMX template is falling short in some regard, that you can modify the template itself in TPDesign4 and therefore have the change automatically generated into the final panel project by G4 PanelBuilder, instead of making the change by hand in TPDesign4 each time you generate a TP4.
Jeff
P.S.
Since I saw someone from the Marketing Department posting here, my boss just had a suggestion. Remove the PANJA stuff from the website and update the panels to Moderos. I can find out where specifically he was looking, but there are some graphics that are showing touchpanels with the Panja name on them and there is a theater control flash type demo that is using an old viewpoint touchpanel. Just some suggestions.
But my "focus group of one" input is that it's usefulness would increase substantially if it included 2 vectors of navigation.
Our approach on residences is to have functionality listed down the left side and area navigation on the top. So if you're in the kitchen, you can access HVAC, Lighting, Music from that screen. Alternatively, if you want to change music for the whole-house, you'd pick the function from the left, which would pull up the screen for housewide music.
That way, you're never more than one-two clicks from anything. The "cost" is that some people might be confused by two vectors of navigation. Depending on the client, we can downplay that with the actual UI.
Also make sure you download the new G4Panel Builder and play with the new aluminium Smoke template, it is the first to offer multiple color palletes built in. Let us know what you think.
I'll let you know as soon as TPI4 firmware that supports it gets released.
But it looks promising.
- Chip
I should have stated that currently only the Modero 12, 15, and 17 firmware is released that supports the new features (multiple pallettes, pallette naming, chameleon images, layer ordering).
But since you like the feedback so much, here's some more:
90% of the projects where we use the templates go with the Earthtone and Crimson Curves. Some of the others are cool, but they're a bit gadgety and not very warm. In the theater, that's not a big deal, but elsewhere in the house, we find that the women of the house are MUCH more receptive to the warmth and neutrality of these two design. Some are just fully turned off by the industrial look. And if the women don't like it, the men have to work that much harder to justify the budget (except in my house, where me gets what me wants....whoops -- gotta go clean the litter box and mop the floor).
So it's a bit disappointing to hear that the old templates won't be updated with the new capabilities. I hope you'll have more of their ilk forthcoming.
One additional suggestion -- why don't you put mock-ups of prospective templates on your website and let us riff-raff vote on them like we do with the modules?
-Bill
I can see in TPD4 where I can select between different palletes, but should I have a similar option in PB for this? My "color schemes..." menu selection is greyed out when I have an aluminum smoke project open.
Thanks,
- Chip
Chip,
You definitely should be able to get to both the Project->Color Schemes menu item and the associated toolbar button as well with an Aluminum Smoke template open. The requirement for these items being enabled is that the current template being used has as least two palettes created for it. Can you tell me specifically what panel type of Aluminum Smoke you are using? And if this happens with other panel types of this template as well? Thanks.
I just launched P.B. and created new projects for the 7500, 8400, CV7, CA12, and CA15 specifying aluminum smoke - the option doesn't light up for any of those... (Nor for the TPI4 1024x768 project I created the other day)
Running XP Pro SP1, if knowing the OS version makes any difference.
- Chip
- A lot of the templates have a very dark look. This may look cool for some residential projects, I find most (commercial) customers want to see bright looking panels.
- Some of the controls on the templates needs to be thought out better: For instance the audio conference control page does not contain dial/pickup nor hangup buttons.
- It would be great if more customized icons were made available. In my opinion icons can greatly assist in enhancing the user friendlyness of a gui. Too often I have to revert back to the extensive old G3's icon set.
One of the benefits of the palette selector is the fact that the files that make use of this MUST make use of palette entries for all items (all items that are to be color changed when selecting another palette).
What this means to the users of the templates is:
When you use one of those files it is VERY easy to modify the colors. You simply open up the Edit Palettes dialog (CTRL + E) and all the palette entries use friendly names and you adjust the palette to match your needs. It becomes really simple to make the UI fit what color needs the design calls for.
You can see an example of the palette editor in the attached image.
Hello Everyone,
Just thought I would post my working example of the aluminum smoke template. It was started by our other designer,Shawn, and I finished it for use in a client's home. It is in a very simple, one room theater.
AMX Staff... here's what we do with what you give us.
Programmers... any feedback or your own examples posted here would be great to see.
Thanks,
Kevin
Senior Do-gooder
OK... how do i make the file small enough to upload? I already compressed it down to 11MB from 14MB? Damn, I'll figure it out and repost.
My work is almost all residential, and not one of the factory styles has ever passed muster with a couple. But a tweak with background and colors, and all of a sudden it looks great.
So my input is: keep it coming, it is hugely appreciated, just perhaps a little more elegance rather than "coolness."
Bill Ravenel