Need help on AXT-CV10

[Deleted User]

I am an absolute novice when it comes to the world of programming AMX equipment. For that matter, I do not have any experience in programming any AV automation devices. Because my church cannot afford to hire professional AV automation expertise, I have taken up this task. I do have some experience when it comes to PC hardware and programming.

So my saga begins. I purchased an AXT-CV10 to be used as the control panel. I also have a Axcent3 and Axcent3 Pro as the controllers. Equipment to be controlled for now are a projector, DVD/VHS players, CD player, plasma panel display, etc. - I think you get the picture.

I think I need to start with the AXT-CV10 panel. I think it is a fairly old panel. How can I tell if it is a G2 or G3 panel and firmware rev? I want to upgrade the firmware of this panel to the latest possible firmware available without involving additional dollars.

After updating this panel to the latest available firmware, what development tools do I need to get going?

Can anyone point me in the right direction to start? Your help is much appreciated.

Thanks for your help in advance.

Henry Kwan

Thomas Hayes

Hello Henry
The firmware version is located in the panels 'setup' page. Is there a program already loaded onto the panel? If so the easiest way to get to the setup pages is to power down the panel, press and hold yuor finger in the middle of the screen and power the unit back up. It may take up to 30 sec's for the panel to jump to the setup page. I have several of these panels installed and 3 sitting on my desk without any problems. Once your ready to proceed just post what you want to do and I'm sure that someone(myself included) will be more than willing and able to help you.

Jill

Bonjour Henry
Thomas has already mentioned one way to obtain the panels firmware version. To program the panel you will require a software program from AMX called TPDesign version 3 , usually refered to as TP3 TPD3. This will allow you to create the buttons that will act as the GUI between the user and Axcent III. Likewise I am willing to help you out with any questions about how to get started, offer you some sample designs of mine etc.

Chip Moody

hslkwan wrote:

How can I tell if it is a G2 or G3 panel and firmware rev? I want to upgrade the firmware of this panel to the latest possible firmware available without involving additional dollars.

The CA/CV/CG series panels only ever shipped with G3 firmware - they never had G2.

Software availability issues aside, I wouldn't fret too much with firmware versions on the panel. I don't recall the updated versions having any fixes that were critical...

[Deleted User]

Thanks for everyone's reply. I've followed the instruction from Thomas and got to the Setup page.

There is a program already loaded. How can I remove this program from memory? When I got to the Setup page, there is a Protected Setup button. But I did not know the code to enter the Protected Setup page. I suppose that once I enter into the Protected Setup page, I could clear the memory, etc. May be the easiest thing to do is to reset everything to the factory default. Is there a way to perform this?

Aside from Jill suggestion of getting TPDesign3, I was also told the NetLinx Studio can also program this panel and Axcess3/Pro. Is that so and which tool is better for my purpose?

Thank you again for everyone help.

Regards,

Henry Kwan

Danny Campbell

Henry,

The default password would be 1988. I don't remember if the CA10 had a page to clear the memory, but there is a ZAP! command that you can send to it using the serial port.

I've attached a copy of the manual that you would normally get with the touch panel.

Danny

Thomas Hayes

Like Chip mentioned I wouldn't worry to much about the firmware unless you have a problem that seems related to the version #. You can get into the protected page with '1205'. I'll post the exact button you want for erasing the currant program tomorrow once I get back into the office and look at mine.

Thomas Hayes

'Protected setup', 'System Page', 'Factory Reset' That should wipe out the old program. As a rule of thumb I will upload the current program in the panel to keep as a back up. The old program may offer you some help as to how are setup and work once you look at it in TP3.

[Deleted User]

Thanks you for everyone's help again.

I managed to build a RS232 cable and user Hyperterminal to communicate with the panel. I did not know that I could upload the current program, especially for the purpose of using it as a sample. I thought that the current program was in binary and therefore would not be of much use to me. So in my haste, I use the ZAP! comment and cleared the memory.

One interesting thing was that when I restored everything to Factory Default, the Protected Setup password did not get changed to 1988 (if that was the default password). Anyway I somehow managed to get into Protected Setup and changed the password manually to what Danny said was the default password, 1988.

So now I need to download TP3 and start learning about programming the panel. Can someone tell me if Netlinx Studio can be used for programming this panel as well? If so, which tool is better for this purpose?

Regards,

Henry Kwan

bob

No, you can not use Netlinx Studio to program this panel, at least not efficiently. You have to use TPD3 and upload the .tpd file either via serial to the panel direct or through AXlink (via the same serial connection you use to program your processor; then the upload goes through AXlink wiring to the panel itself).

You would usually use Netlinx Studio to write the code for your master and upload it to the master itself. There is also a command terminal available in Studio and you can also perform some debugging on your program.

Greetings,
Bob.

DHawthorne

To clarify, NetLinx Studio can load the panel file, but not create it unless your master code is building the panel on-the-fly (not at all recommended for a novice - even experts would shiver at the thought, though it can be done; no one builds panel files this way as a matter of course). However, loading via Studio over the Axlink connection to the master is horribly slow, you are by far better off loading directly from TPD3 via the serial port. If the panel is in a tough spot to get at the serial connection, you can get away with loading updates via Studio if you turn off bitmaps, fonts and icons (meaning, of course, they can't have changed since the initial load). More than that is just not practical.

[Deleted User]

Thank you for all the good information. It really saves me time by knowing exactly what tools to get to start.

I'm sure I'll be back to ask more questions once I get started in programming the panel and the controllers.

Thank you for all who posted replies to my question.

Henry Kwan

bob

Dave, TPD3 also allows loading a .tpd file over AXlink, not only through serial, but as you said, Axlink is teribly slow and especially if there is a lot of communication over the bus it may even fail to start loading the .tpd.

frthomas

hslkwan wrote:

So now I need to download TP3 and start learning about programming the panel. Can someone tell me if Netlinx Studio can be used for programming this panel as well? If so, which tool is better for this purpose?

Maybe some very high level view could help:

- AMX devices communicate between each other using 3 "bus": Ethernet (for Netlinx), AXLink and ICSNet. Ethernet is, well, ethernet and is of no concern to you with an AXcent. There are differences between the last two, but there are irrelevant when starting. It just happens some devices will have one type (f.e. your touchpanel is AXLink) and some other devices the other (the PLK-DMS in wall panels are ICSNet).

- Most devices also have a serial port for programming and/or communication with third party devices (i.e. no AMX to AMX communication, but PC to AMX or AMX to whatever).

- Ignoring Ethernet, an AMX network (i.e. a collection of devices connected together using one or more of the above bus) has *one* "master". All other devices are assigned (by you or by design) one or more "device numbers". A "device" can have multiple "ports". Every port consists of multiple "channels".
In your case, the Axcent is the master. The panel is a "device", which happens to have a single port consisting of 255 channels (for panels, channels are the panel buttons). When the user presses a button on the panel, the master will be informed over the bus that for device X, port Y, channel Z was pressed.
For a serial port device (such as the Axcent (typically, the same enclosure represents two things: the master AND a device with the ports; each has its own device ID)), every serial port is a port of the device. The channels do not have much use in that case except to signal (to the program) that DTS is on or that type of things. But you can send strings to ports, and this is what is used to send serial data out. Likewise for serial data in, the master will be informed that device X, port Y received some string.

Because 255 buttons is not enough for panels, panels can be allocated up to 4 sequential device numbers (X, X+1, X+2, X+3), each having 255 buttons. Don't ask why multiple devices instead of ports (each panel device has a single port), I don't know either.
In the panel configuration, you can see the place to define X (the device number) and the number of devices to use (sequentially as above). Panels such as yours are typically assigned devices numbers starting from 128.

- Now to program the thingy, you need the manuals of all your devices PLUS the Axcess language manual. The latter will only tell you about the language syntax (FOR loops, IF, and so on). To know what your devices can do, you need their manuals (for example, to know how to configure the baud rate of a serial port). The device manual will also tell you how the device is organized in terms of device, port, channel as well as how to configure them.

- "Programming" the panel is a graphical exercise where you define the panel pages, how to move between pages, and what is the device and channel number of every button. For this, one uses TPDesign 3.x. Version 4 of this program is for the new Modero panels (which BTW use Ethernet for communication).
Using TPDesign, you will create a project corresponding to your panel model, and then use the tools to "draw" the pages, buttons, etc (you can import images). Once it is done, you can download the design to the panel using RS232.
The panel firmware itself proposes an editor but it is very basic and you cannot do anything graphical with it. It may have its use however, to correct f.e. a channel number once the panel is downloaded (instead of re-downloading it, which can take some time).

- "Programming" the master is a real programming exercise, where you indicate what is it your system does when I press a button on the panel. For this, Netlinx studio is the appropriate program. As part of its notion of "project", it can reference the panel design and even send it to the panel, but I would not use that initially. Also Netlinx Studio is designed for the largest multi master solutions, so there can be multiple system within a project; you will feel there are many layers you are not using initially, this is normal.
Here as well, once your program is compiled you can load it on the master using RS-232.

Now here, it is interesting to note that it is your responsibility as programmer/designer to make sure the numbers match. Your program has to have code for every Device, Port, Channel that you used when designing the panels. There is no automatic link. This is a frequent cause of errors, for beginners and experienced user as well.

HTH

Fred

cwpartridge

frthomas wrote:

Don't ask why multiple devices instead of ports (each panel device has a single port), I don't know either.

The reason is this is that G3 panels were designed when Axcess was the only system. Axcess was/is limited to 255 channels/device, so the only way to make a panel have more channels was to create multiple "devices" to represent one single physical device. Axlink was based around Axcess constraints (255 devices, 255 channels/device, 8 levels/device), and changing those constraints would "break" any existing products using Axlink.

There was no concept of ports. Ports were introduced when NetLinx was developed, mainly because of the ugliness (however elegant it was) of having to have multiple "devices" for a single physical device.

That's your AMX History lesson for today!

Chuck