DBX PA setup w/ Custom speakers

DJ Scotty G

Hello, I need some help setting up my unit with my custom speakers:

Per side I have:


(4) Bill Fitzmaurice DR 200 speakers w/ Eminence Beta 8 with 10 piezos

(1) 15 X 4 front loaded/ ported sub box w/ Eminence Delta 15lf drivers

(1) 15 X 2 front loaded/ ported sub box w/ Selenium WPU 1509-SLF drivers


I used to run the system with a Behringer cx3400 x-over and I crossed the DR's at 120HZ and the subs got 45HZ to 120HZ and had tons of punch.

I have a QSC 2450 for the DR running stereo.

I have a Crown Power Base 2 running (1) 15 X 4 sub in bridge mono

I have a Crown CS800 running (1) 15 X 2 sub in Parallel mono

Thanks much,

DJ Scotty G

kpippen

Hello Scotty,

Basically to give you what you had before (if I understood your post) I would start off with custom 2X3 stereo configuration and set crossover like this...

Subs on mono channel to Crowns
HP @ 45Hz, HS @ BW18dB/Oct
LP @ 125Hz, LS @ L-R24dB/Oct
Gain +3 dB

Mains on L/R Stereo channel to QSC
HP @ 127Hz, HS @ L-R24dB/Oct
LP @ Out, LS @ BS6dB/Oct
Gain 0dB

Set gain structure as noted on this page: http://www.dbxpro.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=859

Set proper timing delay for your subs...

Perform Auto-EQ only on one stereo side (other side muted) in fast mode... After Auto-EQ...enable the other side,...set everything from 0Hz to 80Hz to flat (0dB), and manually adjust 2kHz and above to your taste...

Re-check gain structure...

Let me know if this works for you...

Kevin

PS. If Dra or Gadget makes a correction to this post listen to them...:D

Dra

The only thing I see, and it is minor, is that from what I've read on the subject, your reference to 80hz and 2Khz should be 160hz(ish) & 700hz(ish). I don't think we're talking pass / fail here. Maybe you-know-who will chime in.

Gadget, can you shed a little light? :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:

DRA

Gadget

Well...
I must say Dra I'm a little confused? is there something missing here? I see no reference to 80 hz, 2k, 160... I know of the Bill Fitz speakers and have the plans for the DR 200.. holy cow you have 8? thats a lot of firepower on top end...Those are horn loaded and will go quite lo with those 8\" drivers.. but I haven't the time to look them up right now...I think you must have 4 total right? Ok before I get really confused here tell me exactly what you have for speakers, and amps and how they are hooked up...

BTW Bill Fitz is easily approachable and would undoubtedly tell you what his recommendations are if you haven't already contacted him...

Gadget

kpippen

kpippen wrote:

Perform Auto-EQ only on one stereo side (other side muted) in fast mode... After Auto-EQ...enable the other side,...set everything from 0Hz to 80Hz to flat (0dB), and manually adjust 2kHz and above to your taste...

Hi Gary,

He's making reference to my statement above...

Kevin

DJ Scotty G

Hello Gadget

I know of the Bill Fitz speakers and have the plans for the DR 200.. holy cow you have 8?

Yes, I have built 8 of them. 4 per side.

Ok before I get really confused here tell me exactly what you have for speakers, and amps and how they are hooked up...

I have (4) DR200's per side (2) series @ 16ohm + (2) series @ 16 ohm = 8 ohms the two parallel. I have them hooked stereo to a QSC 2450.

I have the sub's hook up like this per side:

(1) 15 X 4 sub box on a Crown power base 2 @ Bridge - mono

(1) 15 X 2 sub box on a Crown CS800 @ Parallel - mono


Amp Rack:

(1) QSC 2450 for the DR200's (4) per side stereo

(1) Crown Power Base 2 for (1) 15 X 4 sub box

(1) Crown Power Base 2 for (1) 15 X 4 sub box

(1) Crown CS800 for (2) 15 X 2 sub boxes

BTW Bill Fitz is easily approachable and would undoubtedly tell you what his recommendations are if you haven't already contacted him...

I have worked with him about x-over settings and he said about 100 HZ to 150HZ with subs. I started to run them at 120HZ and they seemed to like that point, I really don't want to go lower beacuse of just having the 8\" driver. I really love my DR200's and I really hope I can get my DBX PA dialed in to make them sound better. I am building my (4) Tuba 36 subs right now also

Cheers,

DJ Scotty G

kpippen

DJ Scotty G wrote:

I started to run them at 120HZ and they seemed to like that point, I really don't want to go lower beacuse of just having the 8" driver.

Hi Scotty,

Now I'm confused... Which are you high passing at 120Hz...the subs (are they mid-bass?) or the DR200s?...:?

Kevin

DJ Scotty G

Now I'm confused... Which are you high passing at 120Hz...the subs (are they mid-bass?) or the DR200s?...

I am running the DR200's at 120HZ on up to 16k

The subs are setup to do 35HZ to 120HZ.

kpippen

OK Scotty,

I would do a custom 2X6 stereo configuration and set crossovers like this...

15 X 4 Subs: Stereo L/R for two (one for Left, one for Right) Crowns Power Base 2 in Bridge-Mono mode
HP @ 40Hz, HS @ BW18dB/Oct
LP @ 125Hz, LS @ L-R24dB/Oct
Gain +3 dB

15 X 2 Subs: Stereo L/R for the Crown CS800 in stereo mode (not parallel)
HP @ 40Hz, HS @ BW18dB/Oct
LP @ 125Hz, LS @ L-R24dB/Oct
Gain +3 dB

DR200 Mains: Stereo L/R Stereo channel to QSC RMX2450 in stereo mode
HP @ 127Hz, HS @ L-R24dB/Oct
LP @ Out, LS @ BS6dB/Oct
Gain 0dB

Below is a quick-n-dirty example of what I am suggesting... You could also go with a 2X3 or 2X4 configuration and chain your sub amps... Even though you have the DRPA you should click here and download the DriveWare GUI for the DR260 and get the feel of it...



Adjust crossover gains if needed to suite your taste... Keep HP and LP crossover settings the same for the sub channels and don't overlap... Personally I like a little gap between them... Set gain structure as outlined on this page...and set proper delay for your subs...

Perform Auto-EQ with RTA mic (strictly for indoor use) with only one stereo side enabled (other side muted) in fast mode... After Auto-EQ...enable the other side,...set everything from 0Hz to 100Hz to flat (0dB), and manually adjust 700Hz and above to suite your taste...

If you like to read there's lots of good information scattered throughout this thread...

Cheers,

Kevin

PS. Listen to Dra or Gadget if they suggest anything different...:)

Dra

When I 1st saw the GUI image, I thought that Kevin was suggesting something radical. But, I would try it as an experiment. It looked for a moment that the x-over was set-up 3-way. Interesting I thought.
Humor me for a second.

Perside set-up:

4- DR200's Hi (I looked on the site to find the # of 8\" driver in each cab and the cross point to the tweets, but no luck) Cross @ 150 - 250hz

1- 2 x 15 Mid Crossed @ 90 & 150 - 250hz

1- 4 x 15 Lo Crossed @ 40 & 90hz

Pros - Less trash in the subs
- Less strain on the DR200's and amps (more headroom and clarity)
- Added headroom for sub amps
- Gain 2 PEQ's for system tuning
- Output of 2 x 15's vs ? x 8\" in the 125 - 150 / 250 hz range of original set-up
Cons - Reduction of subs by 2 (side)
- Output of 2 x 15's vs ? x 8\" in the 125 - 150 / 250 hz range of original set-up

In the search for the best sound, all options are on the table.

DRA

kpippen

Dra wrote:

In the search for the best sound, all options are on the table.

Hello Dra,

I like your suggestion better because it's even more radical!...and I like radical!...:D Use the 15X2s for mid-bass...good idea!...:idea: What I suggested is pretty much the same as what Scotty previously had with exception to the DriveRack and stereo (I think)...

Sooo...this what your suggesting?...





Kevin

Dra

Yes, that is what I was saying. With the mid / hi x-point determined by the # of 8\" speakers and of coarse, trial & error. I re-read the original post and I believe that he was running all the 15's as subs and crossing at 120hz to the dr200's.

Kevin, you are the 8) coolest 8) , with all your visual aides capability. Here's a thought. Create a post that Gadget can put in the FAQ section, with images like these of the 260's various modules in use. Actually showing permanent cabinate tweeks with the PEQ's, etc. A good tool for DRPA users to see how is can help them, as well as \"Which one should I get, the DRPA or DR260?\".

DRA

kpippen

Dra wrote:

Kevin, you are the 8) coolest 8) , with all your visual aides capability. Here's a thought. Create a post that Gadget can put in the FAQ section, with images like these of the 260's various modules in use. Actually showing permanent cabinate tweeks with the PEQ's, etc. A good tool for DRPA users to see how is can help them, as well as "Which one should I get, the DRPA or DR260?".

Hello Dra,

Thank you very much for the compliment!... Here's a deal...if you and Gadget will come up with a few examples and send me the .dwd device files I will upload the screen shots, compile the text with the screens you want, and create the initial post for Gary...:)

Cheers,

Kevin

DJ Scotty G

Thanks Guys for all your work and input to help me out with my rig. I am going to try both setups and see what one works the best. I will post back and let you know what I find out works the best.


Cheers,

Scotty G

kpippen

Hi Scotty,

Please do post back and let us know how your doing and what you ended-up with... It's always good to know if the suggestions we offer are on target or not...:)

Cheers,

Kevin