Left Low Freq output trouble
VoxDrive
Posts: 3
Greetings all,
I've had the DRPA for 3 years, and it has been trouble-free until recently. I had been running the HIGH outs to MPro 215's powered by a Crown MT1200 (I used Macro 1202 settings, as that was the closest I could find), and the LOW outs to an Mpro Powered 18 with the sister satellite. The setup was in Stereo. No incidences at all. I changed bands and went to a stereo HIGH out (same setup), but ran the LOW OUTS in stereo to a Carvin Power amp (set to \"custom\") and out to 2 Passive Subwoofers. The other night, when I went out front to check the operation of the speakers, I heard static and hum coming from the Left Low end speaker. I re-checked the setup of the DRPA, and all was as it should be. I A/B'd my connections and I found that the LEFT LOW OUTPUT had the noise, but the RIGHT OUTPUT was clean and my signal was there. I reset the unit as per the manual, but still had the problem...So.........I have been running the low end in MONO, utilizing the RIGHT OUT only and bridging the Carvin.
We just ordered new powered subs (Yorkville Elite LS800's), and while there is no setup in the DRPA for them, I'd really like to setup in stereo, as they are both independently powered. Additionally, if the RIGHT LOW OUT goes now, I'm dead in the water. Any ideas on what this could be, and is there something in the 'fix' that I have missed?
Additionally, I have noticed that the DRPA has reset itself independently of the other equipment in the rack on a few occasions as of late since the addition of another MT1200 (replaced the Carvin. I'm buying a new power conditioner AND a UPS for the DRPA, btw, so I AM aware of the need for clean power, but I have tested the DRPA outside of the rack's power conditioner (a Furman) using a high-end Monster Power conditioner, but with the same results.
Any help would be appreciated, including any tuning advice for the Yorkvilles.
Many thanks,
Frank E.
I've had the DRPA for 3 years, and it has been trouble-free until recently. I had been running the HIGH outs to MPro 215's powered by a Crown MT1200 (I used Macro 1202 settings, as that was the closest I could find), and the LOW outs to an Mpro Powered 18 with the sister satellite. The setup was in Stereo. No incidences at all. I changed bands and went to a stereo HIGH out (same setup), but ran the LOW OUTS in stereo to a Carvin Power amp (set to \"custom\") and out to 2 Passive Subwoofers. The other night, when I went out front to check the operation of the speakers, I heard static and hum coming from the Left Low end speaker. I re-checked the setup of the DRPA, and all was as it should be. I A/B'd my connections and I found that the LEFT LOW OUTPUT had the noise, but the RIGHT OUTPUT was clean and my signal was there. I reset the unit as per the manual, but still had the problem...So.........I have been running the low end in MONO, utilizing the RIGHT OUT only and bridging the Carvin.
We just ordered new powered subs (Yorkville Elite LS800's), and while there is no setup in the DRPA for them, I'd really like to setup in stereo, as they are both independently powered. Additionally, if the RIGHT LOW OUT goes now, I'm dead in the water. Any ideas on what this could be, and is there something in the 'fix' that I have missed?
Additionally, I have noticed that the DRPA has reset itself independently of the other equipment in the rack on a few occasions as of late since the addition of another MT1200 (replaced the Carvin. I'm buying a new power conditioner AND a UPS for the DRPA, btw, so I AM aware of the need for clean power, but I have tested the DRPA outside of the rack's power conditioner (a Furman) using a high-end Monster Power conditioner, but with the same results.
Any help would be appreciated, including any tuning advice for the Yorkvilles.
Many thanks,
Frank E.
0
Comments
You need to read the RMF section. There you'll see that the wizard is \"next\" to useless. Do a manual gain structure.
Assuming that the left low out is in fact bad. Assuming that you wish to not spend money to repair it, simply set up a \"biamp tops\" with stereo subs. Now, just set your x-over to use the mid outs as your subs out.
DRA
PS - I've muddle over getting (wishing to get) the LS800P's. Ive heard great things about them. Post back how you like them.
You said you:
does that mean a soft, or hard reset? What is the condition of the output meter for the left low output channel when this problem occurs? Does it show level? If so it's possible the solder joint on the left low out has gone cold...as in a solder problem... flexion and \"usually\" high frequency electrical can soften solder joints.
Make sure it was a HARD reset, and that the output meter is working, then check the connector eternally, and then pop the case and check the solder joints on ALL the outputs (if you feel comfortable with doing that...).
As for the LS 700's if you intend to use the DRPA for control, you will need to set the sub crossover point on the LS700 higher than the point you want top cross the tops, you could just crank it.. 150hz...as for the crossover point it depends on the tops you have and how much power you have for them..(I dididn't see a top listed). larger driver.. lower crossover point..(to a point.. then the more excrusion the muddier the mids become.. usually we spec 90-120hz LR24) less power though raises the crossover point...Use an LR 24 on both lopass, and hipass, and you can let the sub set it's own hipass...(low limit)
Thanks much for your time and effort helping me. I'll go in order here with my replies:
DRA - Yep, I know those subs have internal adjustable crossovers, but I'm sorta old-school (another term for thick-as-a-brick! lol!), and I purchased the Driverack to do that. Although it would be pretty easy to send the signal from my mixer to the subs and adjust the x-over on the sub itself, I would lose SO much that the driverack is doing for me, and I'd have to buy even more gear to compensate. Once we pick up the subs (Thursday), we'll setup the system and try to set the parameters manually. I read Gadget's dissertation in the Archives, so I know I have my work cut out for me, as I am admittedly NOT an audio engineer. When I bough the driverack, ALL my gear was \"in there\", hence it was really idiot's delight. I followed the instructions, set everything and we were golden all the time. NOW, I actually really have to pay attention and actually 'learn' something, but I'm game! I'd definitely consider the Yorkville crossover in an emergency though! I'll definitely re-post once we have the subs up and working.
Gadget - Thanks for answering this. I'm not sure if it was a hard or soft reset. I did it several times under duress with one of the guys reading the manual to me as I followed along. Naturally, i think it was the \"hard\" reset that resets EVERYTHING, but I'll re-check.
Also, I have NO idea with regard to the output meter. I was so \"shocked that I was having a problem that I didn't think to look at it! When I re-check the unit (later tonight!), I'll check that first. Thanks for that one. And yes, I'm totally comfortable opening the unit. I actually performed surgery IN A CLUB on my Triton (had to totally dismantle it, ugh!), so I'm careful and confident. If its a solder joint, I'll get it!
Ok, in your advice on crossing over my new subs, is that info for the LS700's or 800's, or would it not make a differance regardless of the model? Please let me know whenever you get a minute. And sorry, I read the READ THIS FIRST after I posted. The new tops (although we will be replacing them) are Turbosound TXD-121's. We have two of them. I currently run them in stereo through a Crown MT-1200, and I have the gain on both channels set to full (yeah, I know, the Crown does not need to be set that way, it'll use the headroom it needs, etc - I did it for the short term (believe me, we do NOT play loud!) to appease another band member (everybody's got an opinion!) until I could get my hands on another MT-1200, which I have just procured (Yeah!). My plan for the new setup will be to run both Crowns bridged, one left, one right to the Turbosounds, and I will set the gain on both amps to 12'oclock, figuring that it will be (a) correct, and (b) all I'll ever need in the current configuration. Then, I'll just see what the deal is with the new subs as far as manufacturer instructions, advice (if available) and such.
I now have to find your post on the crossovers. I remember Butterworth , but that's it. LR, hmn...i have NEVER messed around with anything but the Wizard, and I have stored several settings, THAT's IT, so this will be a sojourn of epic proportions for me.
Also, our replacements for the Turbos will probablt be 15's with a horn to close the gap a bit. We'll see.
Once again, THANKS for your advice, PLEASE let me know if the settings regarding LS700 & 800 units would be different from what you wrote, and I'll post back once I check he meters, resets, etc.
Cheers!
Frank
By pre-processed, I meant that the LS800P's have internal PEQ's already set.
What Gadget is saying is turn the filter on the subs all the way up to 150?hz and cross them with the DRPA at 100hz LR. Set the HPF at 45hz BW18.
Does that help?
DRA
http://www.yorkville.com/downloads/manuals/omls700p.pdf
Which is the sub you specified..but yes, the 700, 720, and 800 (all 'P' series) would all be treated the same. they all go from 90-150 hz the 800 has a 'shape' control and the 720 has a 'boost' control from 45-90 hz....
A quick look at the TXD121's frequency plot , shows that it falls off quickly below 100 hz, and in fact is 10 db down @ 85hz.. therefore I would recommend the following:
1. set the HPF for the low outs to 40 hz BW 18... you can use the right output, and daisy chain the subs... unfortunately, you'll need an XLR to 1/4\" unbalanced from the DRPA to the first LS700, and then you can daisy chain with a \"guitar\" type cord
2. Set the cutoff switch to 150 hz... 'subwoofer level' control to the 12 o'clock position...(-o0db)
3. In the DRPA set the LPF for the subs @ about 110 hz LR24
4. Set the HPF for the tops somewhere between 110-120hz LR24 ( few hz spread will help with interaction in the crossover region...although 10 hz isn't necessary with an LR 24 @ that low a frequency...)
5. Set the HPF for the tops @ a few hz or right on the actual Xover chosen...
6. The DRPA Hi outs have no LPF so it is said to be set to 'OUT'.
7. I would set up a 2X3 with all custom amps and speakers, you could set up a 2X5 and than the mids would act as a backup as Dra specified..should the right lo out fail...you just go into the mid out xover and set the xover for the sub freq's listed above...
8. Make sure to set the system up for stereo, or linked...NOT dual mono
9. There is much info about system setup in the FAQ section... like Delay for the speaker alignment, and since the subs are NOT front loaded, you'll need to understand that, also, I have added a section on WHY we choose certain xover types over others.
Why would you want to replace the turbo's with the 12's with 15\"s? that would be going backwards... 12's make far better midrange's than 15's do, at least in the 120-2000 hz area...as a low mid.. in the 70-150 hz area in a 4 way, maybe... but stick with the 12's if possible...you won't be disappointed... I use 12\" 2 ways with a 2\" exit B&C 750 horn drivers on a 40X60 horn 2 per side, and Neodymium 12\" woofers... and they are the most AMAZING speakers I have ever used...The originals came with McCauley 12\" (MASSIVE!) drivers, but the more efficient, lighter, and superior sounding Neo woofers made a huge difference...I would re-consider... if you can build, and want to bi-amp the tops (which is an amazing upgrade as well) I have plans and tunings for a system that will take you to the next level...
g