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DriveRack PA settings, EV xi-1152, EAW SB850, Peavey Amps

craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
edited March 2009 in Configuration Wizard
I have just upgraded our PA system to include replacing our crossover with a DriveRack PA. I have the DriveRack PA manuals spread out, have been reading various posts on the Internet, trying to download speaker parameters, looking at amp manuals, and I'm not having much success.

Can anyone help me out with some settings? I have been into the DriveRack PA, also reading, reading, reading. This is our new set up:

Yamaha Ls9 console
Subs speakers = EAW 850
Mid & Hi bi-amped speakers = EV xi-1152A/64F
Sub amp = Peavey CS-4080
Mid amp = Peavey CS-4080
Hi amp = Peavey CS-2000

With our old set up (which was subs and full range, EV T52 2 ways, EV SRA 180 subs, Peavey PV 1.5 amps) I always ran more power than I had speakers for, and I used to roll back the amps to be safe. I am hoping I can set up the Driverack PA PROPERLY and I need help.

I have been to the EAW and EV sites, retrieved some settings, but they do not coincide with all of the options provided in the DRPA.

I did find 2 amps that seem very close to the Peaveys, the Crown Macrotech 2402 and the Crown Macrotech 500. so I used those with sensitivity set at 1.4.

Can anyone provide me with settings while I still have some hair?

Thanks very much.

Comments

  • DraDra Posts: 3,844
    The answer is more reading.
    Go to the READ ME FIRST SECTION above and read the posts there. You will know within a paragraph or two if the post is relavent to your needs.
    Thing covered that you'll need are gain structure, x-over recommendations, system tuning using PEQ's, system balancing to the weakest componect, etc.

    Once you've done that, if you need to follow-up, come on back. We're eager to help (just not re-write the same answer over and over). That is where the RMF section came from.


    DRA
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    I hope it doesn't appear as though I am asking someone else to do my work for me. I have spent hours reading posts as well as the links provided in the \"Understanding\" document. I have learned a lot about how the DriveRack PA is set up, and have come up with the following settings thus far:

    Sub Crossover settings:

    HP = 30 Hz
    BW12
    2.0 dB
    LP = 100 Hz
    LR24

    Mid settings crossover:
    HP = 100Hz
    LR24
    -2.0 dB

    LP = 1.5 mHz
    LR24

    High settings for crossover:
    HP = 1.5 kHz
    LR24
    -7.2 dB

    PEQ settings:
    Filter type = HShelf (I have BELL, HShelf, LShelf, LHShelf available to me)

    SUBS:
    F1 = 50 Hz
    Gain = 4.0 dB
    Q = 2.03

    F2 = 118 Hz
    Gain = 0
    Q = 4.5

    MIDS:
    F1 = 500 Hz
    G = 6.0dB
    Q = 2.63

    F2 = 900Hz
    G = -3.0dB
    Q = 4.5

    Filter type = Bell (I have BELL, HShelf, LShelf, LHShelf available to me)
    HIGH:
    F1 = 1.5 kHz
    G = -4.0 dB
    Q = 4.41

    F2 = 2.12 kHz
    G = -3.0 dB
    Q = 4.41

    F3 = 12.0 kHz
    G = 6.0 dB
    S = 12

    Limiter:
    Mids:
    Threshold = 2.0 dB
    Highs:
    Threshold = - 2.0dB

    Delay
    Mid = None
    High = .56ms

    I am hoping someone out there may be using part/all of the same speaker configuration. I am ok with the gain settings when I get there, as well as the auto-eq when I get there. Does it look to you like I am at least on the right track with my other settings?

    I apologize in advance if I am missing the obvious.

    Thanks in advance.
  • DraDra Posts: 3,844
    Do you have the RTA mic?

    DRA
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    I have a Behringer ECM8000 Measurement mic. I have been trying to learn the DriveRack PA from the chair with a coffee and learn/set some of the settings. Then I will tweak as/if required?

    I will not be actually setting the rig up for a while yet, as we do one gig every 3 months or so.
  • DraDra Posts: 3,844
    I recommend setting half the speakers (whatever that # is) outside as described in the material that you read. Put in the settings that you have and do an auto EQ. If the settings are right it ought to finish qickly with few changes. If not tweek based on what you see.

    DRA
  • GadgetGadget Posts: 4,915
    Looks like you have most of it ...of course I realize you mean KHZ, NOT MHZ :lol::lol: (LP = 1.5 mHz LR24 ) but I would move that HPF on the sub to BW18 for protection... if you look, the HPF for the EV's specs a BW 24...the reason is to protect the woofer....the same is true for those subs... that 30 HZ figure is LOW to begin with, I wouldn't exacerbate the low frequency HPF with a BW 12...

    G
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    Gadget,
    Yep, kHz, don't know where I came up with the megaHertz. Thanks for the catch on the BW24. I also started out with BW24 on the HPF for the EV mids (as they call for), but then I got confused when I read somewhere in the posts that you should match the high end for the subs and the low end for the mids so I ended up switching both to LR by mistake.... gotta read those posts you know or you get scolded :wink: Also, the EV PEQ parameters don't tell me what type of EQ to use, so I have guessed at the Bell, HighShelf, etc... can you point me to a better set of parameters or do they look ok to you?

    Thanks so much for the input.
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    DRA,

    Thanks for the replies. What do you mean by \"outside\"? Why half the speakers? Meanwhile I will go back to the reading to see if I missed it there.
    Thanks again.
  • GadgetGadget Posts: 4,915
    Well...Dra originally sent you to the \"READ ME FIRST BEFORE POSTING\" section....there in the FAQ section...under \"Auto EQ\"
    http://www.dbxpro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=949
    You will find this... in amongst a \"Modicum\" of reading...

    \"If you have been reading up on this site you know that we have discussed taking the system (one stack of speakers) outdoors away from all reflective surfaces and with the mic 8-10 feet out aimed at the space between the low and high components of the top cabinets, selecting the -0- precurve from the Auto EQ menu and establishing a baseline flat preset, that we can then store and recall for a number of purposes. ( note, here would be a good time to also set up a couple of the other precurves for later recall. The “C� curve was the one most preferred but I can see a potential use for the –A- and possibly the B, and C curves as well. ) The Idea hers is to make a pass and then view the product of the Auto EQ pass and then use the post (after) crossover PEQ’s to accomplish the same thing the GEQ did and then clear the GEQ and do another pass with the Auto EQ .. again use the remaining peq’s to get closer to a flat baseline until the product Auto EQ is essentially flat. (remember that speakers react differently the closer they get to their theoretical max output so try and test at your normal concert volume… the DRPA has some limitations here so work within these parameters)This we will store to a preset location (of your choosing, I usually choose a preset I will never use but the preset you replace is always still available in a hard reset to factory default …see your manual) with three presses of the store button where you will be asked to name the preset, select a location for it, and verify that you really want to replace the existing preset. This also presumes that you have read and done the steps in the Welcome “read me first� and start here threads…

    What we have now is a system that outputs all frequencies equally (hopefully.. and of course within the limitations of the Auto EQ system). No hype to any frequencies, no lost frequencies that need to be boosted in order to correct for some system deficiency. Now, IF all frequencies are equal any vocal or instrument that sounds good in and of itself should sound essentially the same (or at least reasonably close if the system has quality components) when reinforced. You may want to boost the 80 hz (first harmonic of the kick drum, the actual center frequency is closer to 300-400hz) , and guitars are @ about 2k, vocal clarity 3.5K and if cymbals are piercing, lower the 7-12 k region. I have even sweetened a preset or two, set up a heavy metal, blues and light rock presets and stored those for recall since the more options you have when you’re under the gun the better chance you have of having a quick preset that is going to work for your situation.

    The stored flat preset can also be used to evaluate what a room is doing to your sound… when we can actually DO an Auto EQ that is. I like to take the measurement mic and aim it at the floor or ceiling in the room. This eliminates a lot of potential reflections that will color the results, The mic should be no farther away from a surface than about ¼ of an inch, and aimed directly at the surface at 90 degrees to the surface. This then becomes a pressure zone microphone (PZM). Where do you put the mic? Well.. that’s a loaded question. The best thing is to take multiple measurements in varying locations and average the results. This can be somewhat challenging and so will interpreting the results of the Auto EQ passes. If your THAT interested in the measurement of your system may I again suggest you get into FFT measurement systems like SMAART, which, once you get up to speed can REALLY allow you to tune your system to it’s full potential. An adder bonus is the that SMAART is capable of working in conjunction with the Driverack system (not the DRPA though.. sorry)

    Please see \"the new indoor Auto EQ method\" for some further thoughts and techniques that work.\"

    That is the \"outdoor method \"...There is also the \"New indoor method\":
    http://www.dbxpro.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=953
    conveniently located JUST above it...

    I am wondering if you have been reading this stuff? or just posts?
    Hmmm..
    G
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    Hi Gadget,

    Yep, I went through the info, but even before I was advised by Dra \"You will know within a paragraph or two if the post is relavent to your needs. \" I did just that, read the first para or so to determine relevance. Didn't think I was into the auto eq section yet so I never dwelled on it. I am pretty sure I'll be ok when I actually do the auto eq. Even saw the photos in the \"New indoor auto-eq method\" post above the one you quoted. Again I thought \"this is not what I need right now\".

    Sorry if I'm frustrating you guys, just trying to get to first base before I worry about completing the run. I will go to the next step with the settings I have (with your recommended mods). Thanks.
  • GadgetGadget Posts: 4,915
    No frustration...you just need to be very specific...As you well know, the learning curve is quite steep... but the rewards are very real and VERY worth the effort..as for the \"relevance\" of any topic..as you've seen...if you skip over things you will miss out. If you don't know about the DRPA power off THUMP... you better find out...

    As for the PEQ's... That 12K filter (F3 = 12.0 kHz G = 6.0 dB S = 12)
    it\"s a high shelf, with a slope of 12db per octave and a gain of 6 db... and it's the \"CD horn Equalization...The others are \"bell\" type...

    As for the delay, that's about a 6\" delay...(sound travels @ .885 ms/foot
    1125 feet per second
    within the finite spectrum that sound takes up, low and high frequency sounds arrive at the same time over a given distance.
    humidity and temperature have an effect on wave propagation.)
    We truncate that to 1ms/foot...for simplicities sake...
    G
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    Already read about the thump. So far we have been 100% disciplined at lowering amp input attenuators, then powering amps down as the first step in the shut down process and of course the reverse in power up. Thanks for the other info as well. I got the delay setting from the EV specs, so hopefully it's ok.
  • DraDra Posts: 3,844
    Don't forget about the bar maid that, as she comes by to ask if you need anything, trips on the power cord and unplugs your whole mix position. POP! Your lighting guy trying to find an open ciruit, turns off YOUR breaker trying to find which one over by the left corner of the stage. POP! Yeah, I know... 600w par cans on a wall outlet.... put needless to say, buy a cheap UPS. You won't regret it.

    DRA
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    That's a great idea. I read about the ups idea, but it never sunk in until now. Buy a ups, put the DRPA alone on it. Thanks!
  • DennisDennis Posts: 801
    \"Buy a ups, put the DRPA alone on it.\"

    How about the LS9???????

    Dennis
  • craiggmfmcraiggmfm Posts: 12
    Ever feel like you been walking around with your head in a box? I do. No kidding I'll put the LS9 on a ups. The DRPA is at FOH, so I may just use the same ups, have to check the power requirements. Duh why didn't I think of that. Thanks Dennis.
  • GadgetGadget Posts: 4,915
    :lol::lol::lol::lol: :roll:
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