Another Auto EQ Question

Merle T

I'm new here, and new to managing live sound for my band from stage (Bass Player in Blues Band). I've read the 'start here' thread and dozens of auto EQ threads, have my crossover and gain setup correct, but still have a auto EQ question(s) with my new to me DRPA+.

I have two PVX12's for mains in stereo, and a PV118 sub in mono. I usually try to place the sub on the floor centered at gigs when possible, or to one side when necessary. So when I do the indoor/outdoor method, or EQing for a room, I read that just turning on one 'stack' is the way to go. But in my case what about the sub? Move it to one side and EQ with one top and the sub? Or just use one top?

Next question. I read where EQing for a room, put the mic on the floor on a towel when running auto EQ at a venue....so dumb question, is the top also on the floor at this point, or up on it's stand?

I must say there is a ton of info in these forums, but seems every definitive thread has links to other threads, which have links to other threads, and it's easy to get lost, so sorry if this is covered already.

Dra

The mic on the floor is just to eliminate the nearest reflection from messing with the reading. Keep the speakers in their used positions.
Because the sub will be +3db in comparison to the eventual high energy, reduce the high output filter gain by -3db to keep the balance (after completion and the second top is turned on).

DRA

Merle T

Ok, Now I am at the point trying to get a flat curve stored from GEQ to PEQ, and no matter what I do it seems to have no affect when re-running auto EQ. I must be doing something wrong.

1. My setup again is the Peavy tops stereo linked, single Peavy sub in mono.
2. I run auto EQ using single top (other top and sub off at the DRPA+ panel) using the indoor method.
3. I run auto EQ and get ~ 50 to 250 +3db, 315 to 630 -3db, 800 to 4K +3db
4. I update the PEQ
5. I re-rum auto EQ get get the same results except for a couple of single freq changes.

So I must be doing something wrong, especially when my xover for the tops is 100hz and I'm getting +3db well below that.

Do I need to change my setup to mono? My goal was/is to get a flat curve for the top's.

Dra

What setting did you use for the PEQs?

DRA

Merle T

PEQ LR Hi = ON, Flatten, Bell
F1: 150hz, 3db, 2.03Q
F2: 400hz, -3db, 7.83Q
F3: 1.9KHz, 3db, .56Q

PEQ Lo = Off

I can even double the +/- db values and see little to no change.

Dra

Can you hear the changes?

DRA

Merle T

Yes, I can hear the difference when turning on/off the PEQ, as well as GEQ. So working as designed? I been tweaking the Q's and moved the mic closer, when rerunning auto EQ comes back pretty flat now with most all freq's +3db. I can live with that since it's pretty flat now, but don't understand it. I would have thought after setting up PEQ's (once tweaked well) then rerunning auto EQ the PEQ would compensate for the speaker cut/boost, so Auto EQ and GEQ would be close to a zero flatline. Going -3db on the cross over has no affect.

So I hear more of a change turning on/off the GEQ after rerunning than the PEQ, but both have an affect on playing music.

Dra

and you are saying that you can make the cuts boosts to +-6db and still the 2nd auto eq pass yields the original +-3db adjustments. Try a radical change. Reverse the + to -, and the - to +. See what happens.

DRA

Merle T

I just made the 1.6K +3db boost a -12db cut, rerun auto EQ, and GEQ still shows those freq's +3, and I used the widest Q. Now the amp driving the cabinet has DSP, I triple checked all those are flat, no PEQ ot DEQ on the amp, all flat. So maybe my DRPA+, mic, or cable are messed up?

Dra

It is possible that in the PA+ (I can only reference the original PA and the 260), the PEQ is ignored during the process. The PA & 260 do take into account. I see no benefit to ignoring the adjustment. How else could you fine tune? I would call or email tech support. Tell them the extents you have taken with no additional changes to the result.

DRA

Merle T

Thanks for your help...I sent tech supt an email, will let you know what I find out.

Merle T

Still no answer from tech support, never used them before so not sure how long to wait before bumping them again. I did some more looking and found this in their FAQ's. Second bullet leads me to believe the auto EQ has changed with PA+ and outside the PEQ (and probably X-over too).

What are the differences between the DriveRack PA and DriveRack PA+?

The DriveRack PA+ is the next generation of the DriveRack PA. It is optimized for DJ and small club sound systems. The PA+ has everything the DriveRack PA had, plus the below additions.
Soft Power up/down feature to help prevent power spikes
True stand alone Real Time Analyzer[/b]
Output Mute Buttons
Auto Leveler (Left/Right and High/Mid/Low crossover optimizer)
Improved Auto EQ algorithm, which provides faster completion and better sounding results
Additional speaker and amplifier tunings
USB port for field updatable firmware updates.


So far my workaround, since my power amp has DSP with 8 PEQ filters, is to pump my own pink noise thru the mixer and measure with a RTA app I have, use the 3 PA+ PEQ's to flatten the main cuts/boosts, then the amp's 8 PEQ's to refine. However, I suspect running auto EQ to pink a venue will still ignore the 3 PA+ PEQ's, and therefore be no benefit, or I could just rely on the amp PEQ's and not use PA+ PEQ's, and still be able to auto EQ from a flat speaker response, and adjust GEQ from there. Thought/suggestions?

Dra

My dealings with tech support (email) have been regarding the Zonepro and ZC's. They responded pretty quickly. If it has been a day... try again.

DRA

Merle T

OK, after much back and forth with tech support, boils down to a defective PA+ or mic. Anyone know how to check the mic? I have only the one RTA-M mic. I'm trying to avoid sending the PA+ in for service only to have it come back NTF because my mic is bad.

Oh, and I did try a different top (yamaha), mic on floor, stand, different room. On the plus side, I am very good now at navigating and changing all the tools

Dra

I had a bad mic. My symptoms were way different. Have you dropped it? If your mixer has phantom power, check it like a regular mic. Do you know anyone with a reference mic (of any kind) that you could borrow? I lean toward the PA+ though.

DRA

Merle T

Tried the mic thru my mixer and it works. I even played pink noise on my phone to the mic, and used my ipad RTM program, all the frequencies were being picked up. So glad I saved the PA+ box...Thanks DRA!!!!

Ref dropping the mic, haven't (yet), but are thay that sensitive to drops? Maybe I shouldn't carry it in my back pocket when setting up.

Dra

They ain't no 58. That's for sure. Elevated on a boom and pulled over on its nose after snagging the cable.... bad.

DRA