I'm having a tough time locating NX35s. Everyone seems to need to order from the manufacturer and they're several weeks out still. I would be happy to look at the Community line.
I had bid on some NX35s from Ebay but the buyer told me they would not ship until mid-November.
There are quite a few. It looks like the MVP line is in the price range you suggested but they look like the bottom of the Community lineup. Of course, their bottom line may be better than other companies' top line.
Jerry... let me ask you this... IS this ONLY theater...ONLY spoken word and theater type applications? because if that is the deal than I would suggest a totally different strategy.... let me know...
G
I am looking at a pair of these - looks like they are several years old. Still more questions than answers. It seems that I should get 4 of the same speaker.
Yes, I will put music through the speakers. Although not inended for DJ-type work, it is possible that they could be used for this purpose. The priority is musical theater and choir.
Any thoughs on the Mackie C300Z? I'm looking at availability as well now.
There are some Yorkville E10 speakers on Ebay - I could get 4 of them but it seems as though with 10\" speakers, a sub-woofer would be needed, but I may be wrong. The E10s don't have the power handling I would like but for the current production, they would probably be fine.
Jerry, in your last post you said something about a used pair...of what? there isn't a reference to anything I can see...
How about this, you mentioned this was a gym, and Gym's are terribly reflective rooms that the sound worse the louder things are... they are also subject to a lot of high frequency bounce from horn type speakers...It looks to me like you could do this job nicely with the CPL series of speakers from Community...I have installed these in many houses of worship with terrible acoustics and got the output on the audience and on the people... The CPL 23 is an 8 inch co-axial speaker that has a dome tweeter which will not excite the room like a horn type will...these little puppies will REALLY CRANK when driven (in fact we put a Digam 5000 on them and they got STUPID LOUD!) There are a few benefits here that transcend the diminutive size... 12\" high 9.5\" wide and 12\" deep (roughly) and weigh only 16 pounds.... :!:
I think I paid like $150 or less...for these... they sound really nice, with the lack of a horn they won't throw the sound as far which will in tern not excite the space like a horn loaded speaker would...and they are cheap! They also have a CPL 27 with a second woofer that will get you down to about 60 hz (70 for the 23) if you think yo need it..and adds about 10 lbs...
Now I personally know these speakers, I don't know the these I also found some QSC AD-S82 which does have a horn if you think you need that... list is $230 so I imagine they are in the $150-200 range as well.I DO NOT KNOW THESE SPEAKERS, but the community has embraced their entry into the speaker market pretty universally.
Now what I would suggest is a speaker stand that would get the speakers up and that would get the sound on the people. wouldn't take much...I'd personally take some of the old brake rotors I have ( I own an auto shop also...) weld a pole to them ( or a pipe scree in mount, and pipe) since the speakers are small and light weight you wouldn't need much...so that they angle down and keep the sound on the audience and off the people...The CPL's have a set of mounts for stands built in...
You don't need big speakers for this purpose.. these would get the sound where it needs to be without overkill, AND they sound amazing as point source speakers (the sound all emanates from one source) eliminating all sorts of image blurring interactions.
check it out..
G
I don't like Macke :evil:
those E10's have a good sound as well..they would work.. but still ... see above...I didn't find any E 10's on Ebay got a link?
Oh and at under $50 a pair the Sampson LS2 speakers stands are hard to beat...I just found them...
Gymnasium - wood floor, brick walls, accoustic tile ceiling. I'm having a serious change of position on speakers due to this discussion. I can see people looking at 'puny' 8\" speakers and thinking, \"how am I going to hear anything\" but if they sound as good as you say, I'll see if I can find some. I would have gone for the NX35s but they seem to be on backorder everywhere. There is one possible source in CA that I need to follow up on.
So, my current list in order of preference is as follows:
NX35
E12 Elite
CPL27
CPL23
Bose 802? I am guessing this should either be funny or grounds for termination.
I'm keeping a good eye on this board so any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I'll let everyone know what I end up with once I have everything in hand.
The Australian monitor speakers that I have are 10\"
not
'puny' 8\"
The have a similar look to the Yorkville E10
The 12\" Australian monitor speakers would be better especially if you might run DJ type work
Yes, I will put music through the speakers. Although not inended for DJ-type work, it is possible that they could be used for this purpose.
The reason that I went with the 10� is I am nearly as old as G and the 10\" speakers weigh 10 kg and the 12\" were 18 kg. Getting too heavy to lift above my head onto a speaker stand
We also meet in a Gymnasium - wood floor, brick walls, acoustic tile ceiling.
The few things that I have learnt are:-
1 Minimise the number of speakers in the room. We now have only 2 FOH speakers and 1 sub. (All muso’s have wired in ear monitoring. (No gtr amps and foldback speakers) They are now happy as they can hear a vast improvement in the FOH sound. Gtr amps and foldback speakers muffle the sound the audience hears).
2 If possible have a centre cluster apposed to speakers left and right
3 Use horn loaded speakers (Not cone loaded speakers like bose 802's as I had.)They spray sound in all directions and the audience hears the sound from the speakers and reflected sound of the walls and floor
4 Acoustic material around room, and lots of people to \"soak up\" or minimise the reflexive surfaces
That would be me.. the \"puny\" speakers with the dome tweeters...the deal is they excite the room less...in a Gym, there is a real \"max volume\", where the more you pour in, the poorer the sound is....It's going to be extremely important to get the sound on the people and keep it off the walls, floor and ceiling ...or your intelligibility will go right out the window...you really don't need anything that gets really loud and I don't know what you need a lot of bass for, but if you check the specs, the CPL's will go almost as low as the JRX 125's...If this truly is theater, then if I walked in and saw those huge speakers I'd be like \"Holy crap, whats that all about\" The thing is in theater, to me, it's all about taking the visual aspect of the sound and lighting and making it blend into the background... think of the poor people sitting right next to the speakers... they don't want their heads blown off to get the sound dispersed...with the CPLs you could get 6 and distribute the sound even more evenly and it would still be under $800...add 3 pair of stands and your still under $1000...
If you have to have something \"more impressive\" then get the Veris 12/64's I think they said they could get them to you within a week...probably less. Still well within your price range, and @ 35 ~lbs...not too big to handle. http://www.northernsound.net/Sales/spea ... frame.html
Gadget
BTW the E10's are still on ebay and would work great as well..
I know the E 10 p raised some eyebrows, so I have to assume that the E10's would as well...
Gadget, what do you mean here? Raised good or raised.... be careful.
I had also thought about 3 sets of something smaller, but adding a future sub to go with the system would require running 3 mono set or a separate out from the board for just the sub.
Funny how you come with a spefic question about the JRX and ..... 4 pages later.....
I have since been hobnobbing with a couple of the big boys over at the PSW and one of them is Phillip Graham who graciously offered his work on the principles of mixing, which I posted in the FAQ section...But he has just installed and tuned a system with the Community Veris 3294 and was very pleased with the results. If Phil believes in them you can surely recommend them with confidence. Those were some that I have recommended as well if you remember...
Interesting...Thats quite a system... 10 of those CPL's should warm up that space nicely...How are you going to deploy them? What are you using to get them up? When is the first performance?
OK. When you start a response with \"Interesting\", that makes me ask some questions.
6 speakers will be used for the house - two front, two 1/3 of the way back, and two 2/3 of the way back. Using the 260 for alignment. I am planning on using speaker stands - the ones I'm looking at have holes already in the post so I will attach the bracket on the 27s to the posts.
First performance is a couple of weeks away. So, if I'm doing something stupid, speak now or forever hold your peace.
No I said interesting because we were talking about something totally different for no monitors.. and 4 house speakers....The 3 XLS amps I assume are for the house system...and the XTI for the monitors...Aniother reason I said that was, I thought the budget was ...X and suddenly there is 10 speakers, and a 260 which add up to more than I thought you were spending on the whole system..I suspect I was wrong... I am certain the CPL's will cover the space and excite the room less than the other horn loaded speakers...That's a LOT of speaker wire though...Now, when you get the system up and running I'm not 100 % certain... with 6 speakers covering the audience, that you will need to treat them as delay towers...since everyone will be getting the sound at the same time (in other words the sound doesn't have to travel a long way from the stage to the delay towers.. It will be interesting.. I think it will sound awesome...you realize you will be getting \"studio monitor\" and not only THAT but POINT SOURCE studio monitor sound at every seat...The thing is, with CD (constant directivity) horns there are distortions in the horn, inconsistencies in the frequency response, the people close will be BLOWN away... they are large and heavy..
I think the other guy's would rather have the large horn loaded speakers, but they won't sound as good.. you may get slightly better low end projection form an individual speaker, but 6, 8\" beats 4, 10's or 4 12's...and you'll have more even coverage, you won't have to kill those close to the speakers, and the sound will be waaaayyyy more natural and the vocals will sound awesome...Should be great! Why the XTI 4000? that's over kill for any of the speakers... I like to add a little VERY SOFT foam or cloth under boundary mics set on the floor...to damp any vibrations...
Those speakers are small enough that a device to aim the speakers down a \"bit\"even a wedge under the plate of the stand to get the sound a bit higher and aimed down to the audience would be a great addition.. 10 degrees or so would help a lot...this would go a long way toward getting the sound on the people and off the hard surfaces.
Keep us informed...
Gadget
Comments
What the heck does this expresion mean G
Another pearl from the U.S of A
I like to \"keep up to snuff\" with your lingo
Mark
PS I have PM'ed you 3 times but none been opened??
Is there a problem???
first one was on Wed Sep 24, 2008 7:56 pm (Australian time)
I had bid on some NX35s from Ebay but the buyer told me they would not ship until mid-November.
Thanks.
Sorry Mark, but since this site got upgraded I don't get notified of PM's any more I guess. I always did before...I'll check my settings, thanks
G
Thanks in advance.
Jerry
G
What do you think?
Jerry
Thoughts?
Jerry
DRA
Any thoughs on the Mackie C300Z? I'm looking at availability as well now.
Jerry
How about this, you mentioned this was a gym, and Gym's are terribly reflective rooms that the sound worse the louder things are... they are also subject to a lot of high frequency bounce from horn type speakers...It looks to me like you could do this job nicely with the CPL series of speakers from Community...I have installed these in many houses of worship with terrible acoustics and got the output on the audience and on the people... The CPL 23 is an 8 inch co-axial speaker that has a dome tweeter which will not excite the room like a horn type will...these little puppies will REALLY CRANK when driven (in fact we put a Digam 5000 on them and they got STUPID LOUD!) There are a few benefits here that transcend the diminutive size... 12\" high 9.5\" wide and 12\" deep (roughly) and weigh only 16 pounds.... :!:
I think I paid like $150 or less...for these... they sound really nice, with the lack of a horn they won't throw the sound as far which will in tern not excite the space like a horn loaded speaker would...and they are cheap! They also have a CPL 27 with a second woofer that will get you down to about 60 hz (70 for the 23) if you think yo need it..and adds about 10 lbs...
Now I personally know these speakers, I don't know the these I also found some QSC AD-S82 which does have a horn if you think you need that... list is $230 so I imagine they are in the $150-200 range as well.I DO NOT KNOW THESE SPEAKERS, but the community has embraced their entry into the speaker market pretty universally.
Now what I would suggest is a speaker stand that would get the speakers up and that would get the sound on the people. wouldn't take much...I'd personally take some of the old brake rotors I have ( I own an auto shop also...) weld a pole to them ( or a pipe scree in mount, and pipe) since the speakers are small and light weight you wouldn't need much...so that they angle down and keep the sound on the audience and off the people...The CPL's have a set of mounts for stands built in...
Here is a link
http://www.northernsound.net/Sales/spea ... frame.html
http://www.northernsound.net/Sales/spea ... frame.html
and
http://www.qscaudio.com/products/speake ... ad_s82.htm
You don't need big speakers for this purpose.. these would get the sound where it needs to be without overkill, AND they sound amazing as point source speakers (the sound all emanates from one source) eliminating all sorts of image blurring interactions.
check it out..
G
I don't like Macke :evil:
those E10's have a good sound as well..they would work.. but still ... see above...I didn't find any E 10's on Ebay got a link?
Oh and at under $50 a pair the Sampson LS2 speakers stands are hard to beat...I just found them...
Jerry, Is it a school gym, church gym, wall material, floor type, etc. For what you are doing, 10\" ought to be fine.
DRA
http://cgi.ebay.com/Yorkville-E10-Elite ... 286.c0.m14
and this
http://cgi.ebay.com/Yorkville-E10-Elite ... .m20.l1116
I know the E 10 p raised some eyebrows, so I have to assume that the E10's would as well...
And yes, as I stated above I think those Community CPL 23's would do the job..
Never did find an EX 350 though...
G
I have just installed some Australian Monitor XR10 2-Way Loudspeakers in our Church
Do you have Australian Monitor over there???
They sound fantastic for a small speaker.
We use a KV2 KX1.5 sub as well.
Both great value and sound
I use the xr12 - 2 ways at work. The guest haven't been able to blow these speakers up after 2 years
http://www.australianmonitor.com.au/AM/ ... =3&cid=112
http://www.kxaudio.com/products.asp?ProdID=KX1.5
Fanman20
Bose 802's
Sorry G
I just had to say it
Sorry
Sorry
JerryW please forget this suggestion
Suggestions like this could get a man kicked off this forum
Fanman20
So, my current list in order of preference is as follows:
NX35
E12 Elite
CPL27
CPL23
Bose 802? I am guessing this should either be funny or grounds for termination.
I'm keeping a good eye on this board so any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I'll let everyone know what I end up with once I have everything in hand.
Thanks again for everything.
Jerry
The Australian monitor speakers that I have are 10\"
not The have a similar look to the Yorkville E10
The 12\" Australian monitor speakers would be better especially if you might run DJ type work
The reason that I went with the 10� is I am nearly as old as G and the 10\" speakers weigh 10 kg and the 12\" were 18 kg. Getting too heavy to lift above my head onto a speaker stand
We also meet in a Gymnasium - wood floor, brick walls, acoustic tile ceiling.
The few things that I have learnt are:-
1 Minimise the number of speakers in the room. We now have only 2 FOH speakers and 1 sub. (All muso’s have wired in ear monitoring. (No gtr amps and foldback speakers) They are now happy as they can hear a vast improvement in the FOH sound. Gtr amps and foldback speakers muffle the sound the audience hears).
2 If possible have a centre cluster apposed to speakers left and right
3 Use horn loaded speakers (Not cone loaded speakers like bose 802's as I had.)They spray sound in all directions and the audience hears the sound from the speakers and reflected sound of the walls and floor
4 Acoustic material around room, and lots of people to \"soak up\" or minimise the reflexive surfaces
A few thoughts hopefully to help
Fanman20
No insult meant by the use of the word 'puny'. I had imagined big 15\" speakers to meet everyone when they came in, so it' a change of thought for me.
Someone mentioned the use of dome tweeters as opposed to horns to minimize the reverberation. What do you think?
Jerry
If you have to have something \"more impressive\" then get the Veris 12/64's I think they said they could get them to you within a week...probably less. Still well within your price range, and @ 35 ~lbs...not too big to handle.
http://www.northernsound.net/Sales/spea ... frame.html
Gadget
BTW the E10's are still on ebay and would work great as well..
No insult taken. The most important thing is for you to get the right solution for you Gymnasium
Can you get Austrailan Montor speakers over there???
Fanman20
Gadget, what do you mean here? Raised good or raised.... be careful.
I had also thought about 3 sets of something smaller, but adding a future sub to go with the system would require running 3 mono set or a separate out from the board for just the sub.
Funny how you come with a spefic question about the JRX and ..... 4 pages later.....
DRA
[/quote]
I said earlier that they were good as well..
G
How goes it? Made a descision?
DRA
G
(1) Mackie Onyx 24.4 Mixer
(1) Crown Xti 4000 Amp
(3) Crown XLS 802 Amps
(6) CPL 27 speakers for house
(4) CPL 27 speakers for monitors
(1) DriveRack PA (for monitors)
(1) DriveRack 260 (for house)
(9) Audio-Technica 3000 series theatre headworn mics (6) C band, (3) D band.
(4) AT U853R hanging choir mics
(2) AT U851R boundary mics
(1) SDJ1 unit for music playback (MP3 files on SD cards)
(1) VoiceWorks Plus for MIDI harmonizing
Comments? And once again, thanks, everyone.
Jerry
Good luck
G
6 speakers will be used for the house - two front, two 1/3 of the way back, and two 2/3 of the way back. Using the 260 for alignment. I am planning on using speaker stands - the ones I'm looking at have holes already in the post so I will attach the bracket on the 27s to the posts.
First performance is a couple of weeks away. So, if I'm doing something stupid, speak now or forever hold your peace.
Jerry
I think the other guy's would rather have the large horn loaded speakers, but they won't sound as good.. you may get slightly better low end projection form an individual speaker, but 6, 8\" beats 4, 10's or 4 12's...and you'll have more even coverage, you won't have to kill those close to the speakers, and the sound will be waaaayyyy more natural and the vocals will sound awesome...Should be great! Why the XTI 4000? that's over kill for any of the speakers... I like to add a little VERY SOFT foam or cloth under boundary mics set on the floor...to damp any vibrations...
Those speakers are small enough that a device to aim the speakers down a \"bit\"even a wedge under the plate of the stand to get the sound a bit higher and aimed down to the audience would be a great addition.. 10 degrees or so would help a lot...this would go a long way toward getting the sound on the people and off the hard surfaces.
Keep us informed...
Gadget