This time i had limiter off. The mixer is pushing the same as it was without the drpa in the chain, all levels look good i turned limiter back on after setup not sure how hard its working, how can u tell? I used the My Band eq model instead of flat and it did a lot of changes there PEQ 3 subtle changes as mentioned before. I dont have compression on as others say they dont like it but ill probably try it just to see at next practice. I still need to take it outside again and run the flat eq but them My Band sounds good much more bass in the mix now, drums soind tight!
I am not insisting on compression just saying at some point ill try it out. I have no wish to get the volume to max at 32, 28 is great but when i couldnt turn the amp eve half way up before, i knew i had set it up wrong somehow, that parts fine now so is the bass
I guess i have some learning to do on the peq i printed out a post that mentions the three frequency changes i posted but maybe better off to turn that off for now while i continue to learn the other bits still
I have no wish to get the volume to max at 32, 28 is great but when i couldnt turn the amp eve half way up before, i knew i had set it up wrong somehow
I am ready to give up here... :roll:
I am not insisting on compression just saying at some point ill try it out.
I have no wish to get the volume to max at 32, 28 is great but when i couldnt turn the amp eve half way up before, i knew i had set it up wrong somehow
I am ready to give up here... :roll:
I am not insisting on compression just saying at some point ill try it out.
:?
UFDA!
Is this thing on????
Sorry, not sure what point I'm missing here, not trying to aggravate you. I ran the wizard. I then did the gain structure using the pink noise, I turned the amp up to clipping then brought it down some so it is not clipping at all. Then I turned the limiter on in the DRPA. It seems I am not using the PEQ right from previous posts so I have that turned off for now. I have not used compression yet. I don't know if I'll need to at some point as I haven't gotten that far (Still working on all the other options first) What is it that I'm missing or not hearing from you?
Gadget said that using the compressor is not good. Some people you know said that they didn't like using it. You are not using anf like the results, but you add that in the future you will try it any way. It could sound as if you are trying to convince Gadget to give permission to use it or approve of using it (because you really want to).
Here's the deal. The DRPA's compressor has a valued place, IN THE RIGHT SITUATION. For example, if you were running sound for a stand-up comic, like Sam Kinnesin, who goes from a whisper to a scream...then the compressor would be the perfect tool to add gain (but you better have the system tuned well to not induce feedback) to the whisper and squash the scream. But in the typical set-up the compressor can be a major problem and really hurt the quality of sound.
Gadget said that using the compressor is not good. Some people you know said that they didn't like using it. You are not using anf like the results, but you add that in the future you will try it any way. It could sound as if you are trying to convince Gadget to give permission to use it or approve of using it (because you really want to).
Here's the deal. The DRPA's compressor has a valued place, IN THE RIGHT SITUATION. For example, if you were running sound for a stand-up comic, like Sam Kinnesin, who goes from a whisper to a scream...then the compressor would be the perfect tool to add gain (but you better have the system tuned well to not induce feedback) to the whisper and squash the scream. But in the typical set-up the compressor can be a major problem and really hurt the quality of sound.
Compression kills the dynamics of music.
DRA
Gotcha. Thanks for that explanation. My original comment just meant to suggest that I have been doing my part reading the forums etc and that's why I am not using the compressor but just for the sake of being familiar with all aspects and training my ear etc... I will try turning it later just to hear the results, not that I would keep it on. (I was just talking about trying out everything in the DRPA for familiarization not for permanent use in my own patches, I plan to press every button this thing has at some point!) I agree, from all the reading, I see no reason to use this with my rock band as the dynamics don't need to be squashed.
So to be clear, I've read the compressor is not what I'll need, and- It's not being used.
I understand the amp doesn't have to go to any a particular level it just needs to never clip, I've got it set this way. (about 6db under clip after running the gain structure process)
I think all of this is correct and am agreeing with what's been said unless I'm still missing something(?)
Right now, I'm reading more on the PEQ as it was pointed out I wasn't using that correctly. So, I'm trying to look at more info on that and the best use for it etc....
Lastly, I need to take the system outside again and get the flat response as I lost the initial one I did. I ran the auto EQ in house but the flat response didn't sound as good as the "My Band" curve so I am using that for tonight's practice until I can pull the PA outside again this weekend.
After doing baseline measurements outdoors, save the results to a couple of different user presets so that when you make future changes at a venue, you still have an unchanged baseline preset saved.
Good..but I also don't want to have you ever again say something like this...
great but when i couldnt turn the amp eve half way up before, i knew i had set it up wrong somehow
Now.. the thing about the compressor :
I am not using the compressor but just for the sake of being familiar with all aspects and training my ear etc... I will try turning it later just to hear the results
If it's done correctly you will NOT hear it...The results should be pretty difficult to actually hear. AND it can induce/create feedback.
Remember that storing a preset takes 3 presses of the [store] button, and you'll need to answer some questions like what name do you want for the preset and where do you want it and do you REALLY want to overwrite the preset location you chose?
Cool, gotcha. I will get it back outside this weekend and save several baseline patches and go from there.
Now I am reading up on PEQ to see if I should be adjusting anything there etc. It's not sounding bad, the bass is good with the My Band preset, a little honky on the mid range at least in the vocals. The JRX125 JBL speakers are not the best but for cheap all in one system they work fine. Learning more about EQ will be my friend though.
On the outside setup for the EQ I've read people using different mic placement and one speaker vs two speaker, has a standard consensus been reached on the best placement?
n the DRPA you can keep pushing the mixer output and blow right past the limiter and into the amp to clip it. Avoid that at all costs.
EXACTLY why expecting the limiter to protect your speakers is a BAD IDEA!!!! :roll:
Yea, this should not be a problem if your mixer is set up correctly. Leaving the DRPA out of the equation, it's always been my understanding that the gain setting on the mixer is the same as the first step of the gain setting when including the DRPA. You take you input (mic, guitar, whatever) use PFL to adjust the trim to the point that you have a strong signal but are not clipping.
Usually I do my vocal the adjust it's fader to 0 and then adjust everything else and bring the faders of everything else down further to keep the vocals on top but the gain adjustment for everything is the same steps.
No clipping on board/mixer and no clipping in power-amp.
The only difference for me no is I am balancing it all with the input/output of the DRPA as well but it seems pretty straight forward.
On the outside setup for the EQ I've read people using different mic placement and one speaker vs two speaker, has a standard consensus been reached on the best placement?
1. If you have tops only then use only one top..
2. If you have tops and subs then only one stack...
3. If the speakers are on a stick, put them on a stick
4. place the mic on a stand aimed at the speaker
5. The distance is dependent on the speaker and the power available...If you have some serious power and quality speakers 25 feet...if you have less power, or smaller speakers you might want to try 10 feet, 15 feet, 20 feet...you may try them all and see which sounds best, you have a LOT of preset locations (with a TON of useless presets... )
Treelines (in the distance) will cause slapback, close ones will usually absorb most of the energy but driveways or concrete are no-no's...
get the sound of the speakers as loud as the unit will let you (if you run loud) or at the volume you play...
As Dennis said save the final product to several locations.. one as master and others you can modify
G
That's a PERFECT checklist for me, thanks for that! In regard to some of this depending on the speakers and power available...I think 'serious power' may be different to different people so what would you think of this:
QSC RMX 2450 (Think it cranks out about 750 watts a side to the cabs I have) and the JBL JRX 125 2X15 plus tweeter
What distance would be most appropriate for that kind of system?
Gadget, I thought I read where you wrote one time that when dealing with the JRX line, that you should try to get as far away from them as possible. :shock:
I've heard these are not great but then it's in a pretty low price range so you get what you pay for I guess....
I was thinking of selling them off eventually to pay for monitors and use the current QSC 2450 amp for the monitors and get new speakers and power amp but I'm not sure what the next step up would be with speakers that wouldn't be a LOT of money. I would be moving from $400 a pop on my current speakers to double that on y next speakers but also, I don't have roadies so I'm looking at something I can transport myself... weight and size a factor there. Still Jokes on my current speakers make me sad *sniff *sniff....
Actually, a former regular here set up an all JRX system in a church. 2 - 125's, 2 - 115's and 2 - 1x18 subs. Had great success. The honest truth is that a Driverack, properly used, can make just about any speakers sound good. I think you'll be able to do the same.
Actually, a former regular here set up an all JRX system in a church. 2 - 125's, 2 - 115's and 2 - 1x18 subs. Had great success. The honest truth is that a Driverack, properly used, can make just about any speakers sound good. I think you'll be able to do the same.
DRA
Good to know :-) That's all a ways away for me but for now...for a fairly compact system the band can move by ourselves and fit in my vehicle, things are pretty good.
Comments
I guess i have some learning to do on the peq i printed out a post that mentions the three frequency changes i posted but maybe better off to turn that off for now while i continue to learn the other bits still
UFDA!
Is this thing on????
Sorry, not sure what point I'm missing here, not trying to aggravate you. I ran the wizard. I then did the gain structure using the pink noise, I turned the amp up to clipping then brought it down some so it is not clipping at all. Then I turned the limiter on in the DRPA. It seems I am not using the PEQ right from previous posts so I have that turned off for now. I have not used compression yet. I don't know if I'll need to at some point as I haven't gotten that far (Still working on all the other options first) What is it that I'm missing or not hearing from you?
Here's the deal. The DRPA's compressor has a valued place, IN THE RIGHT SITUATION. For example, if you were running sound for a stand-up comic, like Sam Kinnesin, who goes from a whisper to a scream...then the compressor would be the perfect tool to add gain (but you better have the system tuned well to not induce feedback) to the whisper and squash the scream. But in the typical set-up the compressor can be a major problem and really hurt the quality of sound.
Compression kills the dynamics of music.
DRA
Gotcha. Thanks for that explanation. My original comment just meant to suggest that I have been doing my part reading the forums etc and that's why I am not using the compressor but just for the sake of being familiar with all aspects and training my ear etc... I will try turning it later just to hear the results, not that I would keep it on. (I was just talking about trying out everything in the DRPA for familiarization not for permanent use in my own patches, I plan to press every button this thing has at some point!) I agree, from all the reading, I see no reason to use this with my rock band as the dynamics don't need to be squashed.
So to be clear, I've read the compressor is not what I'll need, and- It's not being used.
I understand the amp doesn't have to go to any a particular level it just needs to never clip, I've got it set this way. (about 6db under clip after running the gain structure process)
I think all of this is correct and am agreeing with what's been said unless I'm still missing something(?)
Right now, I'm reading more on the PEQ as it was pointed out I wasn't using that correctly. So, I'm trying to look at more info on that and the best use for it etc....
Lastly, I need to take the system outside again and get the flat response as I lost the initial one I did. I ran the auto EQ in house but the flat response didn't sound as good as the "My Band" curve so I am using that for tonight's practice until I can pull the PA outside again this weekend.
Dennis
Now.. the thing about the compressor :
If it's done correctly you will NOT hear it...The results should be pretty difficult to actually hear. AND it can induce/create feedback.
Remember that storing a preset takes 3 presses of the [store] button, and you'll need to answer some questions like what name do you want for the preset and where do you want it and do you REALLY want to overwrite the preset location you chose?
Gadget
Now I am reading up on PEQ to see if I should be adjusting anything there etc. It's not sounding bad, the bass is good with the My Band preset, a little honky on the mid range at least in the vocals. The JRX125 JBL speakers are not the best but for cheap all in one system they work fine. Learning more about EQ will be my friend though.
EXACTLY why expecting the limiter to protect your speakers is a BAD IDEA!!!! :roll:
Yea, this should not be a problem if your mixer is set up correctly. Leaving the DRPA out of the equation, it's always been my understanding that the gain setting on the mixer is the same as the first step of the gain setting when including the DRPA. You take you input (mic, guitar, whatever) use PFL to adjust the trim to the point that you have a strong signal but are not clipping.
Usually I do my vocal the adjust it's fader to 0 and then adjust everything else and bring the faders of everything else down further to keep the vocals on top but the gain adjustment for everything is the same steps.
No clipping on board/mixer and no clipping in power-amp.
The only difference for me no is I am balancing it all with the input/output of the DRPA as well but it seems pretty straight forward.
1. If you have tops only then use only one top..
2. If you have tops and subs then only one stack...
3. If the speakers are on a stick, put them on a stick
4. place the mic on a stand aimed at the speaker
5. The distance is dependent on the speaker and the power available...If you have some serious power and quality speakers 25 feet...if you have less power, or smaller speakers you might want to try 10 feet, 15 feet, 20 feet...you may try them all and see which sounds best, you have a LOT of preset locations (with a TON of useless presets...
Treelines (in the distance) will cause slapback, close ones will usually absorb most of the energy but driveways or concrete are no-no's...
get the sound of the speakers as loud as the unit will let you (if you run loud) or at the volume you play...
As Dennis said save the final product to several locations.. one as master and others you can modify
G
QSC RMX 2450 (Think it cranks out about 750 watts a side to the cabs I have) and the JBL JRX 125 2X15 plus tweeter
What distance would be most appropriate for that kind of system?
G
DRA
I was thinking of selling them off eventually to pay for monitors and use the current QSC 2450 amp for the monitors and get new speakers and power amp but I'm not sure what the next step up would be with speakers that wouldn't be a LOT of money. I would be moving from $400 a pop on my current speakers to double that on y next speakers but also, I don't have roadies so I'm looking at something I can transport myself... weight and size a factor there. Still Jokes on my current speakers make me sad *sniff *sniff....
DRA
Good to know :-) That's all a ways away for me but for now...for a fairly compact system the band can move by ourselves and fit in my vehicle, things are pretty good.
G